7030 transferring hydraulic oil again

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   Back story: 7030 was new to me a few years ago and a back burner project. Unknown hours or history. I changed all fluids and filters and used Agco filters in the rear housings. Used it for 2 days last spring with no problems but started transferring oil from the transmission to rear end. 
I tore the pump down, and the seal between the pumps was in terrible shape. The shaft and all other components looked just fine. I replaced the seal, and put it back together. Had only started and moved it a few times in the week or so since I reassembled, but seemed to be fine and oil levels were steady. I took it for a 20 minute drive to check fields today and it stopped in its tracks. It had transferred all the oil again. 
What did I do wrong?
 Pump and lines appear to be nearly identical to my later tractors, so I think its been updated at some point. 
Thanks in advance

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Adam Stratton Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: SW MO Points: 1363	Post Options Post Reply Quote Adam Stratton Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: 7030 transferring hydraulic oil again Posted: 06 Jun 2019 at 5:56pm
	Back story: 7030 was new to me a few years ago and a back burner project. Unknown hours or history. I changed all fluids and filters and used Agco filters in the rear housings. Used it for 2 days last spring with no problems but started transferring oil from the transmission to rear end. I tore the pump down, and the seal between the pumps was in terrible shape. The shaft and all other components looked just fine. I replaced the seal, and put it back together. Had only started and moved it a few times in the week or so since I reassembled, but seemed to be fine and oil levels were steady. I took it for a 20 minute drive to check fields today and it stopped in its tracks. It had transferred all the oil again. What did I do wrong? Pump and lines appear to be nearly identical to my later tractors, so I think its been updated at some point. Thanks in advance

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Adam Stratton Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: SW MO Points: 1363	Post Options Post Reply Quote Adam Stratton Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 06 Jun 2019 at 6:33pm
	I realized that I didnt loctite the seal in place. I forgot until after I already drove it into place, and didnt want to risk ruining it by removing and reinstalling it. Could that be the problem?

MACK Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Points: 7664	Post Options Post Reply Quote MACK Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 06 Jun 2019 at 8:55pm
	Have saw bushing seize to shaft and spin it into seal several times. Make sure bushing is tight in housing. MACK

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21937	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 07 Jun 2019 at 8:27pm
	If you don't tape the splines on the shaft you may damage the seal when you slide it over the splines...………... Also, make sure the left hand filter door opens FULLY to prevent high suction at that area which can cause the shaft seal to fail. Bend the tabs on the door or add an O-ring shim under the filter screen to help open door farther. Edited by DrAllis - 07 Jun 2019 at 8:30pm

Adam Stratton Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: SW MO Points: 1363	Post Options Post Reply Quote Adam Stratton Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 07 Jun 2019 at 9:50pm
	Thanks for the replies and advice. I walked through the diagnostic procedure in the shop manual and it indicated the seal again. Probably ought to spend the extra $10 and start with a new seal, use loctite and tape the shaft this time. The other time I didn't remove the filter housing, but played with the door and thought it was functioning properly. Thank you again

tbran Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Paris Tn Points: 3529	Post Options Post Reply Quote tbran Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 07 Jun 2019 at 10:21pm
	What Doc sez - it cured a 7030 we had issues with -- after in stalling a new seal and it still trasferred. Hey Dr. The 9600 series uses turbo boost to send oil back to the transmission - What about sending turbo boost to the rear end - install a tube from the lower or upper sight glass hole - and run the tube to the tranny then vent the tranny with a large vent tube extended. Either that or if worried about pressurizing the rear housing, drain the oil from the sight glass opening and with the aid of an A&A venturi siphon move the oil back to the trans sump using turbo boost. Thoughts ?
	When told "it's not the money,it's the principle", remember, it's always the money..

Ron(AB) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 27 Dec 2009 Location: Alberta Points: 962	Post Options Post Reply Quote Ron(AB) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 07 Jun 2019 at 11:29pm
	Does this happen with the 8000 series too?

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21937	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 08 Jun 2019 at 6:52am
	That turbo boost idea is interesting. A small boost line (1/4" ??) may be all it needs. The fill cap breather would have to be secured so it wouldn't blow off. I suppose the fill cap breather would limit the amount of pressure actually made and would still allow the venting of excess air when dropping a 3-point hitch with a big bale of hay on it ??

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21937	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 08 Jun 2019 at 2:29pm
	Don't discount the possibility that the gerotor pump is worn and leaking internally causing oil pressure to be forced by that shaft seal.

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21937	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 08 Jun 2019 at 4:41pm
	I had a conversation today with an AGCO dealer I've done business with for many years. We talked a couple of weeks ago about this particular tractor. He had been battling a 7040 with an oil transfer problem. He could let the tractor sit at their shop and run all day at full throttle and never transfer any oil from tranny to rear end and as soon as the Customer would road it 20 miles it would transfer. They replaced the pump shaft seal multiple times. He finally found the hydraulic pump drive shaft bushing to be stuck on the shaft and bushing was spinning in the rear housings bore. A new bushing was installed with Loctite in the housing (it fit good) and a new seal and they are testing to see if that finally has cured the issue. I sure hope so.

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21937	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 08 Jun 2019 at 7:28pm
	I just remembered another independent shop that had trouble with a 7020 tractor and oil transferring. He had installed at least 2 pump seals and in short order the oil transfer started again. We talked about all the possibilities and I never heard from him again. This was more than a year ago. I just now called him and asked him how that deal ever turned out. He told me he installed the pump shaft seal BACKWARDS from what it was originally installed. So, maybe he's onto something ?? Install the seal with the spring towards the gerotor pump so the oil can't transfer that way !!