Hugger with calmer rolls question
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
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URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=157354
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Topic: Hugger with calmer rolls question
Posted By: Lonn
Subject: Hugger with calmer rolls question
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 5:30pm
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I'm considering rebuilding an old hugger 6 row and am wondering if anyone here has any experience with the combination. In 200 bu corn can you go right in with a chisel without plugging up? Are the Calmer stripper plates better than gleaner plates? Is the extra expense of the plates worth it or will the rolls alone do the trick? I'm told by the dealer that there's no need to slow the gathering chains down like is needed on CaseIH or Deere. Thanks ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Replies:
Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 6:31pm
| Get you a disc chisel and leave it alone. I have the first style Glenco 9 shank w/4in twists and have no problem on 200 bu stalks. |
Posted By: victoryallis
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 7:33pm
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If you do it post back with results. ------------- 8030 and 8050MFWD, 7580, 3 6080's, 160, 7060, 175, heirloom D17, Deere 8760 |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 8:06pm
------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
SteveM C/IL wrote:Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 9:52pm
| I always thought a Hugger was about as good as it got when it came to stalk destruction. Now, I'm talking a NEW Hugger, not one with worn blades on the rolls. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2019 at 5:14am
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Dr, besides simplicity and reliability is the hugger a whole lot better than a late model black head? I currently have a black head and admittedly, it needs the roll blades flipped from side to side. It does good but not good enough in its current state. I got this hugger for the 52 real cheap but it needs everything. I was hoping to avoid using a stalk chopper. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: victoryallis
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2019 at 7:44am
Couple years ago my hugger was in similar shape. Rewelded wear edge on the deck plates and replacing the rear part of the rolls was a huge help. The guys on Agtalk even have a modification for the rolls so it pulls less trash in. What about Yetter Devastors instead of the Calmer rolls. ------------- 8030 and 8050MFWD, 7580, 3 6080's, 160, 7060, 175, heirloom D17, Deere 8760 |
Posted By: GM Guy
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 2:57am
I dont think anyone has a better designed deck plate shape than The Hugger 3000 all the way back to the orange heads. IIRC Drago even copies it (shape, obviously the automatic adjustment is a Drago exclusive) The new 3300 Command has IH style deckplates. Might work in the corn belt, but IMO does not work here. The reason I like the hugger deck plate is that any loose kernel has a chance of getting swept in by a cob or a leaf. Gleaner does seem to do a good job on gathering chain speed on any corn head since the early 80s N series, the early Ns and A series heads seem to run a bit fast for my liking. We have a 1988 Bish Converted N830 rotary head made to fit a L2. that thing runs SLOW. Near perfect loss levels. I ran a 9500 with a 893 for a guy last fall and that thing had terrible ratios and was flinging ears and deck shelling quite bad in a very dry corn situation (13 percent) A buddy in Idaho runs a 893 on a R70 and he was so disappointed he bought different ratio sprockets and got the speeds to a more favorable level and it was doing a good job. As far as residue management, I like the looks of the Calmer, but for the price I think the Snapping Roll Mod (Agco dealers should be able to get a printout with measurements) would be an acceptable substitute. But we dont have the residue and soil you do, so its up to you to guage what will work better in your situation. ------------- Gleaner: the properly engineered and built combine. If you need parts for your Gleaner, we are parting out A's through L2's, so we may be able to help. |
Posted By: farmboy520
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 10:59am
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I'm putting the yetter stalk devastors on my hugger for this next fall to try and elimate the stalk shredding pass in the field. ------------- On the farm: Agco Allis 9695, 7060, 7010, R66, Farmall H, and Farmall F20 (Great Grandpa's) |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 19 Mar 2019 at 7:06am
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I decided for my acres it is just too expensive to convert. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: JimIA
Date Posted: 19 Mar 2019 at 9:48am
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I have always been amazed with the Hugger heads. Low design, great visibility, decent service ability and very reliable well built heads. On a parts view of things the black headers require a lot more parts replacement than the Huggers. The snapping roll knife update does help reduce butt shelling. I should have the bulletin here somewhere, I can send the instructions to anyone interested. Jim ------------- An open eye is much more observant than an open mouth |
Posted By: cwhit
Date Posted: 19 Mar 2019 at 7:20pm
| We replaced the knives and stripper plates on our hugger two seasons ago with Agco stuff. Think you’ll also be very satisfied with the results. We then follow up with a 9 shank soil saver like Steve mentioned and that’s all. Zero issues with trash. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2020 at 11:05pm
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Dragging this up again. I did put new spirals and flutes, all from AGCO last year but there is so much trash that I am still forced to stalk chop, I was wondering on thoughts about sharpening the flutes like on the Calmer rolls. I'm done for this year but next year I was thinking of doing this on one row to try it out. Are the AGCO flutes hard enough to last doing this? ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: GM Guy
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2020 at 11:02pm
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I'd at least try the snapping roll mod, feeds the stalks further back and chews on them better, let alone how much better it feeds. ------------- Gleaner: the properly engineered and built combine. If you need parts for your Gleaner, we are parting out A's through L2's, so we may be able to help. |
Posted By: GM Guy
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2020 at 11:04pm
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AAlso, how bad were your old spirals? If not terrible, I'd be interested in buying them. 50-125 bushel yield environment demands alot less from the head...and more from the budget...lol ------------- Gleaner: the properly engineered and built combine. If you need parts for your Gleaner, we are parting out A's through L2's, so we may be able to help. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2020 at 5:43am
------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Kansas99
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2020 at 6:13am
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Lonn, I'm needing to replace the flutes on my hugger, are you cutting them in a stair step or one short one long pattern? My neighbor cut his one short one long and that made no sense to me, I was going to cut in a stair step like the calmer. ------------- "Thank you for your service Joe & the Ho"-----Joseph Stalin |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2020 at 6:53am
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I was cutting them according to AGCO. Two flutes get cut on each roll about 4" on one side. They get timed so that the cut sides line up with the each spiral end. I like how Calmer does it. But I think I will try sharpening the edges on one row unit and try that next year. I wonder why Gleaner went from 4 flutes on each roll like on the black heads to 3 flutes on the Hugger..... trying to deal with the "wall of steel"? I think I'd be tempted to copy how Calmer cut theirs. Here's the Gleaner link showing what they recommend..... funny Gleaner doesn't sell the flutes already cut. https://www.gleanercombines.com/content/dam/Brands/Gleaner/US/pdf/newsletters/Gleaner-Newsletter-2016Q1.pdf/_jcr_content/renditions/original" rel="nofollow - https://www.gleanercombines.com/content/dam/Brands/Gleaner/US/pdf/newsletters/Gleaner-Newsletter-2016Q1.pdf/_jcr_content/renditions/original ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Amos
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2020 at 6:47pm
I take my spirals when they are worn down and build them up with a hard surface wire I get to put through my welder. It takes a half day to do all 16 of my spirals but it is like a new head for several years after doing them. Its pretty inexpensive wire to buy, might consider doing this to yours that you already have...
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Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2020 at 7:47pm
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New spirals were $101 each a year ago. If I ever need them again I think I'd weld up the old ones. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: soybreedingboy77
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2020 at 10:40am
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Lonn, The hugger head has 3 flutes with 6 blades that engage the stalk. The black head had 4 flutes but the way the were positioned only one blade of each flute engaged the stalk. They upgraded from 4 bites per rev to 6. However, the black head had the front carrier bearing so you could adjust the distance between the rolls. The hugger rollers are “free floating” so in tough stalks the rolls will spread 1/4” to 1/2” which can make adjusting the grass knives a pain. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2020 at 12:53pm
| This mod to the Hugger blades helps tremendously when the roll points start getting worn. They don't look bad until you compare to a brand new one. |
Posted By: Kansas99
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2020 at 7:23pm
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Dr. are you saying to cut them by Agco specs or stair step them like the calmer? As far as the spirals I guess I didn't figure they ever did that much, guess I should hard surface them. I hard surfaced the deck plates years back(just built the rods up square again) and they've lasted for years, probably look at spirals when I put in flutes, you guys don't want to see how bad mine are.  ------------- "Thank you for your service Joe & the Ho"-----Joseph Stalin |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 6:11am
| My comment was about the AGCO recommended mod. I know nothing about Calmer. |
Posted By: mindaswater
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2022 at 1:30pm
"I have a 1500 Min-Til and it won't quite handle the trash. To be honest 200 bu is the low end. I vary from around 200 to 235 average depending on the year. The bottom ground I'm sure is far over that while the high ground is under. And it's in the bottom ground where I can't make it 50 feet without plugging. That's about 1/3 or more of my land." Yea, I can feel your pain, we have an old Deer 8000 Sidehill we keep running just for our bottom ground, that is super hilly too. You appreciate that smaller 6 row head when you're turning around every minute! https://calmercornheads.com/technology-explained/reduces-trash-intake-into-the-combine/" rel="nofollow - Calmer's site has some great videos and discussions about how they are reducing trash intake. You can see the chopped up stalks hitting the ground under the head, before ever making it into the feeder house. On our sidehill, it rolls slow - but it's faster cutting than anything else, and we can't even drive our bigger machines into those fields. We questioned putting thousand dollar rolls on instead of three hundred dollar rolls, but it really does use less horsepower, wish that old 1980's diesel sure appreciates! And we could have done the torch and grinder modifications on our old deere also. In our climate last year's stalks on the ground are there at planting, and completely bio-degraded by harvest. https://calmercornheads.com/technology-explained/does-bt-chopper-residue-wash-away/" rel="nofollow - https://calmercornheads.com/technology-explained/does-bt-chopper-residue-wash-away/ |
Posted By: mindaswater
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2022 at 1:31pm
I guess it would be hard to get Calmer rolls in Russia too! |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2022 at 10:29pm
 ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Old Allis Wags
Date Posted: 05 Nov 2023 at 4:15am
| I know this is old...but are those numbers for the "measurements" on the agco mod pictures in millimeters or what |
Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 05 Nov 2023 at 9:00pm
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They are near 4 in cuts. I cut mine before I used it (recent purchase) so I don't know how they would have been. Everybody seemed to think it was a plus so I did it.
100mm is 3.94 inches then 45 deg angle to edge.
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Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 05 Nov 2023 at 9:22pm
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We are on our second 3308C. The first one had strip bars that were rounded downward. On the second one, they are flat. The first one had the lugs of the gathering chains together. The second one, they are now staggered. It seems like everything they didn’t like about the Hugger, now they are going back to it. On the Hugger flutes, I always thought I should grind a sharp edges on them to cut the stocks better. I never did, but I thought that would make all the difference in. I miss the round bar that was on the Hugger striper bars. ------------- 2-8070FWA PS/8050PS/7080/7045PS/200/D15-II/2-WD45/WD/3-WC/UC/C |