8070 FWA - Wrong Tires?
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
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URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=116979
Printed Date: 03 Jul 2024 at 6:13am
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Topic: 8070 FWA - Wrong Tires?
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Subject: 8070 FWA - Wrong Tires?
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 8:50pm
| I have a 8070 and just noticed something. I has 26" rims on the front and noticed in a prior post they show 24 and 28" as options not 26.. Not such a big deal if they are appropriate height for the Rear tires... But want to make sure they are. Rears are 18.4R38 and the Fronts have 420/85/26. If Im calculating that out correctly that makes I have 16.9R26's on the Front with 18.4R 38's on back. Help me out!! uploads/14834/8070.jpg" rel="nofollow - uploads/14834/8070.jpg |
Replies:
Posted By: Acdiesel
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 8:55pm
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are you having trouble with the front wheel assist binding or trying to pop-out? ------------- D19 diesel,D17 diesel SER.3 D14 NF,D14 WF, D15 SER.II wf D15 SER.2 DIESEL,D15 ser.II nf D12 SER.I, D10 Ser.II 2-720'S Gmc,caterpillar I'm a pharmacist (farm assist) with a PHD (post hole digger) |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 9:10pm
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Just bought so no... when i drove it around didnt notice anything funny either nor did i think the front tires were taller proportionally compared to the rears. When i was looking through the fourms on here someone posted this so im a little nervous ... again this is on someone elses post .. Front Rear 13.6 x 28 18.4 x 38 14.9 x 28 20.8 x 38 or 18.4 x 42 14.9 x 24 16.9 x 38 |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 9:25pm
| . |
Posted By: jiminnd
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 9:28pm
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Could be 16.9 26 is the same height as 13.6 28, I don't know but I used 15'5 38 duals with 18.4 34s, maybe the circumphrense is the same, just a thought. ------------- 1945 C, 1949 WF and WD, 1981 185, 1982 8030, unknown D14(nonrunner) |
Posted By: eighty nine
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 9:34pm
| This link may help , rolling circumference chart. http://commercial.firestone.com/content/dam/bcs-sites/firestone/PDF/RCI.pdf |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 9:51pm
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Posted By: Gerald J.
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 10:29pm
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Tall tires on the front will make the fronts try to out pull the rears and the FWA drive won't survive that well. It will also tend to jump as the fronts slip occasionally. Gerald J. |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 10:42pm
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We bought an 8070 new with 20.8x 38s on the rear and 18.4x26 on front. Front always pulled a little more then the rear. It's still going and has never had the front end touched. IG ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 10:45pm
| NE Farms...did you get that one on Big Iron Auction? |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 10:49pm
| What your saying you have actually have matches/converts over right mine does not |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 10:49pm
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yes I did ... were you bidding against me..haha? |
Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 10:52pm
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Ours are set up the same as ILGleaners. Ours both have diff lock in the front axle. ------------- 2-8070FWA PS/8050PS/7080/7045PS/200/D15-II/2-WD45/WD/3-WC/UC/C |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 10:56pm
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Yes how IL Gleaners is setup and yours goes along with the appropriate tire height... mine does not according to tire calculators and the Owners manual |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 10:59pm
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And they drag there ass going thru the field and look dumb ! What tire does it recommend for 20.8x42s on the rear ? ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 11:06pm
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This is what the manual says according to a prior post Front Rear 13.6 x 28 18.4 x 38 14.9 x 28 20.8 x 38 or 18.4 x 42 14.9 x 24 16.9 x 38
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Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 11:08pm
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Again what i have is 16.9R26's on the Front with 18.4R 38's on back.......... so around 2.5 inches Taller then what im seeing in the prior post as recommendations with those rears what are your guys thoughts? I didnt notice any pulling or anything when i test drove it or anything with the Front wheels on |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2016 at 11:44pm
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Engineering tried to have 2-3% more travel speed (lead) with the fronts compared to the rear (gearing and tire sizes figured in). This primarily was to help with turning. According to the Firestone Tire Data Book http://dawsontireservice.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/FirestoneAgTireDatabook.pdf" rel="nofollow - http://dawsontireservice.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/FirestoneAgTireDatabook.pdf the 16.9-26 has a 4% larger loaded radius than the 13.6-28. This would result in a 6-7% higher travel speed (lead). This will wear out front tires faster and won't help the life of the FWA drivetrain components. The clutch for the FWA will limit the torque to the front wheels, so you may not notice a problem on high traction surfaces. However, the clutch won't be happy doing that continuously either. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 12:12am
| Thats interesting... You confirmed what I was thinking and its appreciated. Now my question now become why do so many of these 8070's have 26" rims on them??? since atleast according to the one owners manual this was not a option for the front rims. Then another question you mention the 3% lead. if one was to put smaller tires on the front then what is called for in theory that would prolong the life of the MFWD but would also lead to less "help" when the 4wd is needed correct? |
Posted By: dpower
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 1:39am
| That tractor was cheap on BIGIRON, cant believe they let it go for that. Congrats |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 4:07am
| yes I was ya bum! lol....shucks...if i'da know'd that i'd a run it up more! lol...well...if ya drives it home, you'll prolly drive past my place! |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 4:11am
| the rules is Dpower...ya gits what ya gits on their auctions...I know sum of them fudge, but if they gits caught...well I don't know what they can do about it! |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 4:12am
| you shoulda bid on it Dpower! |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 6:04am
| I know I've sold 8070's before with 20.8 x 38's on the rear and 16.9 x 26's on the front or maybe it was 18.4 x 26's. Anyway, it was in 1985 model year and probably wasn't in the Owners manual yet....by Fall of 1985 it was all over............ |
Posted By: Peterson
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 6:15am
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To make a long story short, Allis was wrong with putting the 18.4-26's on the front with 20.8-38's. They are to tall. Correct tire size with 18.4-38's are a 13.6-28, or a 14.9-26 if that size is even available. 20.8-38's would be 14.9-28 or 16.9-26. 20.8-42's would take a 16.9-28 or 18.4-26. We put 20.8-42's on our 8050 and I went over all the tire sizes with the tire dealer to find the correct height. ------------- 7095-685I at 255hp, 8070-225HP,8050-210Hp,8030 with 155HP,220 with 670T engine with A-pump, 7580, 185 with 140HP, 2-6080's,6070, S4 D17,wd45,CA,st34 agco, S1 D17 with 3500MK2 |
Posted By: Leon B MO
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 6:58am
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We run 13.6x28 fronts with 18.4x38 with duals on the rear of our 8050, always have. 6500 hours and never been in the front end. Leon B ------------- Uncle always said "Fill the back of the shovel and the front will take care of itself". |
Posted By: WD45
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 7:57am
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Our 8030 had 20:8x38 with 14:9x28 on front. ------------- Fred Dunlop, G,B,CA, WC,WF, 3 WD45`s,gas, diesel and LP,U,D10 series III, D12,D14,D15 SERIES II,D17 Series IV in Gas and Diesel ,D19 GAS and D21,170 185,210 ,220 an I-600 8070 fwd, 716H and 1920H |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 9:25am
| Appreciate all your guys help and thoughts.... Was any of you the 2nd to last bid? This was actually the first time I ever bid on anything at a farm auction (that was over 100 bucks). So bidding one time and winning was kind of unexpected. My dads first cab tractor was a 7030 that he bought in the mid 80's and he always was interested in getting one of the 8000 series but ended up settling on a all green line up..ha I do think the tractor is a solid good tractor that has the MFWD rebuilt not long ago |
Posted By: Peterson
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 9:50am
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That would be my guess. Our 8050's front was wore out from the oversized tires too. Find yourself either a set of 13.6-28's or put some 20.8-38's on the rear. ------------- 7095-685I at 255hp, 8070-225HP,8050-210Hp,8030 with 155HP,220 with 670T engine with A-pump, 7580, 185 with 140HP, 2-6080's,6070, S4 D17,wd45,CA,st34 agco, S1 D17 with 3500MK2 |
Posted By: dpower
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 10:33am
| You did good. Neighbor sold his 8050 two wheel drive last year and it brought 26000. It was rough to and needed work |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 10:45am
While reduced lead would likely reduce the loading of the FWA components, it would also reduce tractive effort-----------------the front wheels are usually in looser soil (first wheels to go over the ground). Turning could also be an issue without some lead. The factory recommendations were based on testing with a number of different lead ratios. The 2-3% seemed to give the best results in the conditions tried. There are always other conditions.  ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Nebraskafarms wrote:Posted By: lowell66dart
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 3:28pm
|
The auto makers use a different ratio on a 4WD truck. They will use say a 4.10/4.11 ratio to make sure the front axle is turning a bit faster than the rear. That prevents the rear from pushing the front, better traction. A tractor would be more forgiving I guess but it would seem you would still want to keep some difference in the ratios/ tire height to achieve the same. ------------- AC 6080 (8030,7060,200,175,D-17HC, 6040,160,6140 all gone) Farmall 1066 & 656 Hi-Clear (for sale), White 2-62 High Clearance, JD 4255 Hi Clear. |
Posted By: wfmurray
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 5:03pm
| Could you not check by measure a length(say A hundred feet ) mark tires and then check to see if it gained or loss .Don't have fourmale but I am sure you can make a compriseon. |
Posted By: michiganmarty
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 5:34pm
| I bought a 8050 with 18.4 x 26 tires on the front, they were wore out, so I found rims and put 14.9 x 28 on. Oh, I did rebuild the front end, meaning kingpins and such. I contribute it to the big tires. I don't know what Chalmers was thinking with the big tires. I also have a 8030 that has 18.4 x 38 on the rear, with 13.6 x 28 on the front. From what I can tell, the use the same rim as the 14.9 x 28 use. This don't seem quite right, but that's what I can see. |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 6:20pm
| sooooo...you gonna drive it home or have it hauled? |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 6:44pm
| as of now im planning on driving it home |
Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 6:54pm
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Our first set of '82's 8070's PS with 6th low and 2nd high were the same speed. 20.8 rear and 14.9 on the front. The 14.9 were shot after 1200 hours. The '85 8070's, like ILGleaner said are nose high with the 18.4 on the front, but the 18.4 last. The 14.9's would break the lungs in half. I like the 18.4 on the front. If we would go to 30" rows, then I don't know what to do. 18.4R38 or 42. I have even dreamed about an AGCO DT275, but, dreaming is free. ------------- 2-8070FWA PS/8050PS/7080/7045PS/200/D15-II/2-WD45/WD/3-WC/UC/C |
Posted By: allischalmerguy
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 8:14pm
Fred Dunlop wanted to share these with you all. ------------- It is great being a disciple of Jesus! 1950 WD, 1957 D17...retired in Iowa, |
Posted By: allischalmerguy
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 8:15pm
 ------------- It is great being a disciple of Jesus! 1950 WD, 1957 D17...retired in Iowa, |
Posted By: allischalmerguy
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 8:17pm
 ------------- It is great being a disciple of Jesus! 1950 WD, 1957 D17...retired in Iowa, |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 8:37pm
| Would you please post the specification page so we can please see the right hand side of the page?? Thanks |
Posted By: allischalmerguy
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 8:50pm
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Neb try this. Have it in the window of your computer. Then hold down the control key and hit the - (minus) key it should make your screen smaller so you can see it. ------------- It is great being a disciple of Jesus! 1950 WD, 1957 D17...retired in Iowa, |
Posted By: allischalmerguy
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 9:05pm
 ------------- It is great being a disciple of Jesus! 1950 WD, 1957 D17...retired in Iowa, |
Posted By: WD45
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 9:10pm
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At bottom of page of 8070 specifications as shown above number is AED 880-8303 ------------- Fred Dunlop, G,B,CA, WC,WF, 3 WD45`s,gas, diesel and LP,U,D10 series III, D12,D14,D15 SERIES II,D17 Series IV in Gas and Diesel ,D19 GAS and D21,170 185,210 ,220 an I-600 8070 fwd, 716H and 1920H |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 9:17pm
| I was bidding on it too NF...but you went higher! |
Posted By: allischalmerguy
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 10:00pm
Thanks Fred Dunlop! Mike ------------- It is great being a disciple of Jesus! 1950 WD, 1957 D17...retired in Iowa, |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 11:03pm
| So I dont think anyone answered this... was allis actually putting on these 26" rims on the tractors?? My tractor is a late 1984. Seems like guys with 85's are who have 26's... maybe Allis was getting rid of surplus parts? |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 11:07pm
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Ours was an 84 bought new it had 18.4x 26. I really wouldn't worry about it. IG ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 11:28pm
| so it it engineered to turn the same speed front and rear? unlike 44's on vehicles that the front turns a bit faster than the rears? |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2016 at 11:58pm
| IL Gleaner i thought you said you had larger tires (20.4's) on the back though I got smaller tires (18.4's)... |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 6:57am
| ALLIS ABSOLUTELY DID PUT 26 INCH FRONT WHEELS ON SOME OF THE LATER 8000 TRACTORS!!!! I SOLD 3 OR 4 OF THEM LIKE THAT! THE ADVERTISING LITERATURE DIDN'T ALWAYS REFLECT WHAT WAS COMING OFF THE ASSEMBLY LINE !! IT ALSO DIDN'T REFLECT THE LATEST POWER SHIFT TRACTORS HAD A FASTER LOW RANGE, BUT THEY DID !!! Also, a 20.8 takes an 18 inch wide wheel and an 18.4 takes a 16 inch wide wheel. |
Posted By: Daehler
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 9:26am
I have 83 that has 18.4-26 tires. I would like to know why guys or dealers ordered them too because I am not a fan of them. I think it was an option that might have been pushed for flotation. Look at all these new tractors, they use wide tires instead of duals. I will say my 83 8070 is harder to stear than my 85 model with 14.9. I know that the pump is about wore out on the stearing and i think it is because of the big tires ------------- 8070FWA,7080 BlackBelly, 7045,2 200s,D19,D17,G, WD,45,UC,7 AC mowers and lots more! "IT TAKES 3 JD's TO OUT DO AN ALLIS, 2 TO MATCH IT IN THE FIELD AND 1 FOR PARTS!" |
Posted By: DanWi
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 10:53am
| Something that I have wondered about and applies here, some brands of tires vs others the same size tire was not the same as others, seemed like goodyears ran on the small side. The other thing is if you your fronts wear out faster because you weight down the front and you are running duals on the back. Then you change from worn out fronts to brand new fronts. I will say from the picture the tractor looks like it is sitting level so many of them look like they are going up hill. If you are thinking about planting with it you may be looking at other sizes so you can make the tractor turn around on the end of the field. |
Posted By: Kevin in WA
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 11:02am
| I would put 18.4x42 on the back and leave the 16.9x26 on the front, would make a nice tractor out of it. |
Posted By: Nebraskafarms
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 11:15am
| I would if i had a 42" rim!! Curious can i just put on the larger 38" tires (20.8R38's) on the 38" rims that currently have on it 18.4R38's or is it a different rim all together?? |
Posted By: Lynn Marshall
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 11:22am
 
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Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 11:25am
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IF; one was to put on 18.4R42 on the rear, did AC have a larger center casting or would I have to run those butt ugly step up rims? ------------- 2-8070FWA PS/8050PS/7080/7045PS/200/D15-II/2-WD45/WD/3-WC/UC/C |
Posted By: Daehler
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 12:03pm
On my 42 the piece that holds the rim to the center is longer. Its a factory non power shift rim with Mexican hat centers. Looks as a 20.8 38 but there is more of a gap between the rim and center. ------------- 8070FWA,7080 BlackBelly, 7045,2 200s,D19,D17,G, WD,45,UC,7 AC mowers and lots more! "IT TAKES 3 JD's TO OUT DO AN ALLIS, 2 TO MATCH IT IN THE FIELD AND 1 FOR PARTS!" |
Posted By: grinder220
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 12:48pm
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Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 12:56pm
I have a set of factory 18.4 x42 s on the rear of my 8070. ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: Gerald J.
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 2:23pm
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The Titan Goodyear ag tire handbook recommends W16A or DD!6 for 18.4-34 bias and approves W15L. For 20.8-38 it recommends W18A, DD18 and approves DW18A. For radial 18.4R38 it recommends W16A, and approves DD16, W15A, and W15L. For radial 20.8R38 it recommends W18A and approves DD18, and DW18A. A bias ply 20.8 on a 16" rim will be larger rolling diameter than on an 18" rim. Radial with its belt may not be larger but the sidewalls will be more bulged and probable not like the extra flexing for a long time. So that book says 20.8 shouldn't be on 16 inch wide rims. Other tire makers may have a different opinion. Gerald J. |
Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 8:24pm
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ILGleaner, next time you have a camera around your 8070, snap a picture or two of your 42's please. ------------- 2-8070FWA PS/8050PS/7080/7045PS/200/D15-II/2-WD45/WD/3-WC/UC/C |
Posted By: Joe(IA)
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 9:16pm
| Unit 3 i have 18.4x42 on my 8050 two wheel drive just a mile from you. I bought it with butt ugly step up rims as you say, but in my opinion look pretty natural compared to some you see! |
Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 9:28pm
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Well Joe, I can't do better then that. LOL. When did you get an 8050. I only see the 7000 series when I drive by. ------------- 2-8070FWA PS/8050PS/7080/7045PS/200/D15-II/2-WD45/WD/3-WC/UC/C |
Posted By: Joe(IA)
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 9:46pm
| I told you I bought a 8050 with 3700 hours when we were waiting in line at Maxyield. Its not at the home place. In my shed west of you at my hog site. Even tho my brother runs a case store you still can't get the orange out of your blood. |
Posted By: Joe(IA)
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 9:47pm
| Im sorry east of you |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2016 at 11:46pm
Yes I will. I will sell you the cast centers and rims and tires and throw in the tractor for free !!!! IG ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 04 Jan 2016 at 4:34pm
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Well, I would, but, ahhh, well, you see, I, ahhh, well, ----- its its its the ahhh whole money thing. ------------- 2-8070FWA PS/8050PS/7080/7045PS/200/D15-II/2-WD45/WD/3-WC/UC/C |
Posted By: michiganmarty
Date Posted: 04 Jan 2016 at 5:34pm
| So, does anybody know what a difference the no spin axle would make with ratios. I didn't see this chart when I put the 14.9 with the 18.4x42. There wasn't a lot of difference between the 20.8x38 and the 42's, and I see a lot of 20.8's with 14.9's. I think the manufactuer has a lot to do with it also. |