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steve(ill) 
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: illinois
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 Posted: 13 Oct 2021 at 5:57pm |
NOPE... no Union Pension... NEVER was in the union... Do what i want, when i want...... Pointing out your ignorance is just ICING ON THE CAKE !! 
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steve(ill)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: illinois
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Posted: 13 Oct 2021 at 6:09pm |
also you keep pointing out about all the "OLD PEOPLE" on this site , that will NOT get the WUHAN SHOT.... Do you realize that the "OVER 65" have the HIGHEST PERCENTAGE of VAX of any age group ? ........... Do your research..
and YOU are WAY OFF the original TOPIC !!....... I thought that was a cardinal SIN for you ?
Edited by steve(ill) - 13 Oct 2021 at 6:12pm
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Tbone95
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Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Location: Michigan
Points: 11607
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Posted: 13 Oct 2021 at 6:26pm |
 FREEDGUY wrote:
Tbone95 wrote:
FREEDGUY wrote:
steve(ill) wrote:
<span style="color: rgb0, 0, 36; : rgb254, 252, 212;">Just how many PENNIES are required to run a battery charger and how will this be any more of a drain on a "GRID" </span><span style="color: rgb0, 0, 36; : rgb254, 252, 212;">
</span> <span style="color: rgb0, 0, 36; : rgb254, 252, 212;">
</span> <span style="color: rgb0, 0, 36; : rgb254, 252, 212;"><b style="">?????? So you think you can drive a car/ truck with BATTERIES all day long, then plug in your 6 amp charger and REFILL it in a few hours ??? You ever hear of Perpetual motion ??  </span> <span style="color: rgb0, 0, 36; : rgb254, 252, 212;">
</span> <span style="color: rgb0, 0, 36; : rgb254, 252, 212;"><b style="">Most of the "chargers" are 240 volts and pull 50 amps to FULLY recharge the batteries in one shift.....WAY beyond your AC unit.</span> |
My current battery charger cost me over a $180 smart ass !! And JUST how do you KNOW so much about EVERYTHING, farm (I assume), take TOO much effort in your "political" stance AND make time for 60,000+ posts ????
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Wow, a whole $180 eh? Just for fun, price a Tesla home charging station, and see what you think.
Think about it, you’re talking about the power to drive a vehicle 100s of miles instead of STARTING a vehicle for a few seconds. |
Why would I do that ? I don't own a TESLA !! From what I've read, 220 volts AC is a WHOLE lot cheaper to run than 110/120 |
Why? That’s an easy one. So you aren’t so ignorant of the topic you’re blathering on. Your $180 12 VDC somehow makes a point for you, but the facts about the topic at hand you shouldn’t look into….ok…,
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ACFarmer
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Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Ohio
Points: 742
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Posted: 13 Oct 2021 at 7:43pm |
FREEDGUY wrote:
So, you're retired, probably taking in WAY too much union pension, pulling in SS payments and have nothing better to do with your time than "scan the site" and belittle whomever disagrees with you  ? Am I accurate on several statements ??? |
If theres anybody on this site that spends too much time on random topics trying to up his post count, I would believe that's you.
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Making A living everyday farming with and working on Allis Equipment
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bemer848
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Joined: 29 Sep 2013
Location: southern IL
Points: 86
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Posted: 13 Oct 2021 at 8:22pm |
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Gassy is tonight another sudsy drinking posting night?
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klinemar
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Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: Michigan
Points: 8002
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Posted: 13 Oct 2021 at 9:26pm |
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FREEDGUY wrote:
So, you're retired, probably taking in WAY too much union pension, pulling in SS payments and have nothing better to do with your time than "scan the site" and belittle whomever disagrees with you Stern Smile ? Am I accurate on several statements ??? So Freedguy your statement about retired persons being on a Union Pension or getting Social Security shows some jealousy!
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Stan IL&TN
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Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Elvis Land
Points: 6730
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Posted: 13 Oct 2021 at 9:35pm |
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I called my engine guy today and told him to build me a 5.7 with fuel injection to give me 3-4 hundred HP which is about double what I have now. That said would you all please buy electric vehicles so there will be a glut of cheap gas for me......please. 😂
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1957 WD45 dad's first AC
1968 one-seventy
1956 F40 Ferguson
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DMiller
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Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: Hermann, Mo
Points: 31094
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Posted: 14 Oct 2021 at 4:43am |
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Buddy of mine is buying up all the used Chainsaws and string trimmers can find here, going to sneak them in thru CA Entry ports by packing them in containers marked 'Scrap' so can corner the Black Market!!!
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Tbone95
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Location: Michigan
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Posted: 14 Oct 2021 at 7:39am |
Stan IL&TN wrote:
I called my engine guy today and told him to build me a 5.7 with fuel injection to give me 3-4 hundred HP which is about double what I have now. That said would you all please buy electric vehicles so there will be a glut of cheap gas for me......please. 😂 |
Ya' know....I seriously wonder about that "cheap gas". I have a hunch, er, a BAD feeling, gas is going to be regulated/taxed/controlled so badly by some means, that the contrary will actually be what happens. 
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Ray54
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Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Location: Paso Robles, Ca
Points: 4544
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Posted: 14 Oct 2021 at 1:57pm |
Kind of back to the subject it takes HORESPOWER to move a people hauler no matter what you call it. Be it horse and buggy, ox cart, salves hauling a chair on there shoulders , gasoline powered car , or electric car you need fuel for it.
We are using all the electric power generated currently ( could use more some day/ brown outs ). Common sense ( which is very uncommon) says any new power generation is going to cost more than power being made now. All hell breaks out if you even think we could build a damm and making hydro power. To get it from solar and wind you need way more panels or mills than a straight math answer would say because they only work part of the time. So all the calculations everyone has been showing need to upped. Just how much is the question. But double the current cost would not be surprise to me.
And what happens when we get cut off from the special materials needed to make all the batteries as the Chinese are way ahead in the race to own them. Just for all the sheepel that lessen to talking heads on TV all the time hope that electric car works out be as cheap as you think.
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steve(ill)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: illinois
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Posted: 14 Oct 2021 at 4:40pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Jordan(OH)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Celina, OH
Points: 1547
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Posted: 14 Oct 2021 at 7:24pm |
jaybmiller wrote:
I can physically get 100A 3 PH from the pole into my house cheaper than 400A single phase. Yeah, sounds crazy, but welcome to Ontario Hydro. Looked into this 4-5 years ago, idea was to repalce the 23HP gas engine on the sawmill with an electric motor. Quiet and clean,great for inside the shop.The 'distribution transformer' needed for the 'magic' to get 2PH, 240V 100 was a freebie, and if you don't connect one leg to the 'power monitor' chunk, that leg is um, shh, 'free' energy. DM's solar story is quite common. Have 5 neighbour's with 10KW systems. Yes, they do make money, but ONLY because the guv said we'll pay you 80c/KwH for 20 YEARS, it's NOT that they actually MAKE 10KwH of solar energy
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But you don't run 1 phase to house, 1 for charger 1, and 1 for charger 2, which is how you made it sound.
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Stan IL&TN
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Location: Elvis Land
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Posted: 14 Oct 2021 at 8:47pm |
I unfortunately agree. If the sale of gas drops so too will the tax revenue and thus they will increase the tax rate. But as far as my wife is concerned I'm going with my first statement.😆
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1957 WD45 dad's first AC
1968 one-seventy
1956 F40 Ferguson
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DMiller
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Location: Hermann, Mo
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 5:13am |
Three Phase 480v can be separated to single phases and use a transformer to drop the single phases to 120 or 240v, was how we did it at the nuke for internal power supplies to the plant. Same distribution breaker center would have 480 3ph 204v 3ph, 240v single ph breakers and 120v panels.
And yes, if readily available it is cheaper to have a 3ph drop sent into a building than a single ph set up.
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jaybmiller
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Greensville,Ont
Points: 22472
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 6:32am |
yeah, I know I didn't xplain real guud...was dumfounded that 3ph drop was cheaper than 400A 'regular' service. good(?) news is I sold next door and the sawmill BEFORE I'd commited to the power upgrade.
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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Les Kerf
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Location: Idaho
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 8:53am |
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The larger underlying issue is EROEI (Energy Returned On Energy Invested)
We consumers tend to look at dollars returned on dollars invested because that is what first impacts us.
The overwhelming majority of so-called 'Green Energy' installations never return as much energy as was used to build them.
Net loss. Pretty tough to keep that up long term
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steve(ill)
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Location: illinois
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 9:17am |
Les....... there is an old joke... " I loose money on every sale, but i make it up in VOLUME" .....
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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jaybmiller
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Location: Greensville,Ont
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 10:38am |
re: Net loss. Pretty tough to keep that up long term
but the federal budget works........ trillions, and trillions in debt, country is still 'doing great'........ 
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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Ray54
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Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Location: Paso Robles, Ca
Points: 4544
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 12:59pm |
steve(ill) wrote:
GEES Ray.... Sounds like you dont think this is A GREAT PLAN !!! |
No clue how it will end. Just know politicians are dummer than rocks so if they demand you do something 99% chance it is wrong.
My first battery powered drill was gift from my parents Skil brand about 1980. It was junk, battery was built into drill no getting another battery and keep going. By the the 90's battery drills where getting some good reviews. I had job that included hanging a bunch of gate off old power poles. Needed 5/8 wholes, did not want use a good augur bit. So I got the new at the time 19.2 Craftsmen 1/2 chuck, better than I expected. My kids get me a impact that used that 19.2 battery. Had no expectation of it being any good. Twenty years latter still works good if I spend money on new battlers every few years.
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Ray54
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 1:02pm |
Hay Steve look at that if I post this get another.............................. But this is 3500.
Would somebody explain what the prize is for post number?
Come on Steve what have they given you..........beside trouble.
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JC-WI
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 1:15pm |
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He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself
The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that."
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 1:16pm |
Ray, YA dont get NUTHIN till you hits 10,000 posts..... Prize for that is 6 empty gum wrappers.... Next step is 20,000 .... 4 old apple cores........ by the time you get to 50,000 you get the GOOD STUFF ! ... 2 worn out draw bar pins !!
Congrats on the 3500 !!!
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Les Kerf
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Joined: 08 May 2020
Location: Idaho
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 3:08pm |
jaybmiller wrote:
re: Net loss. Pretty tough to keep that up long term
but the federal budget works........ trillions, and trillions in debt, country is still 'doing great'........ |
Yup. That which cannot continue, will not continue. When one takes into account the energy costs of building new equipment (mining of raw materials, transportation, refining, manufacturing, etc.), it becomes apparent that the best thing we can do for the environment is to keep the old iron running. This is exactly what this website is dedicated to. Keep up the good work folks! 
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 8:33pm |
(CNN)The Clean Electricity Performance Program, the cornerstone climate policy in Democrats' massive social safety net package, will likely be dropped from the final budget deal after pushback from Sen. Joe Manchin of West Virginia, three congressional sources told CNN."He is not there on the CEPP period. We've been trying," one Democratic aide with knowledge of the negotiations told CNN. The aide told CNN that Democrats are trying to find ways to restructure the program to fit Manchin's concerns while still reducing greenhouse gas emissions. "If there's a deal to be struck in the next few days, I don't think there's anything resembling CEPP in there." The New York Times first reported the measure would likely be cut.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Jordan(OH)
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Location: Celina, OH
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 8:33pm |
DMiller wrote:
Three Phase 480v can be separated to single phases and use a transformer to drop the single phases to 120 or 240v, was how we did it at the nuke for internal power supplies to the plant. Same distribution breaker center would have 480 3ph 204v 3ph, 240v single ph breakers and 120v panels.
And yes, if readily available it is cheaper to have a 3ph drop sent into a building than a single ph set up. |
I'm well aware how 3ph works. But running one phase of 3ph to a structure would only provide L-N loads, no L-L loads.
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 15 Oct 2021 at 8:56pm |
you would have 3 HOT wires that have 240 volts between any 2 wires... and a separate ground... Normally the three wires feed a 3 phase motor..... What you would do in this case is run wires 1 and 2 to one breaker box and have 240 volts single phase... you would run 2 and 3 wires to the second box and have 240 volts single phase ( out of phase with the first box)... then you would run wires 3 and 1 to box #3 to have 240 v single phase ( out of phase with boxes 1 and 2).... the #2 and #3 box would be ONLY 240 volts and could supple a charger / welder / water heater / saw mill motor......... The #1 box would need a transformer to get 120 v out of the 240v supply so you could run lights and wall plugs....... It could work... Have done similar with 480 v 3 phase to run heating elements on single phase 480v.
the only problem might be BALANCE between the 3 legs.. If it is a small transformer feeding just your house, that could be a problem.. If it is a larger transformer feeding several houses, probably not a problem... If it is 3 individual transformers feeding, not a problem.
many small business in the US do similar, but have a 208 volt 3 phase supply... There are a lot of motors, large cooling units, pumps, hot water heaters that can run off 208 v 3 phase (or single phase).... and ANY one of the HOT leads to ground gives a 120 v power for the lights and plugs.... that is the purpose of starting with 208 v 3 phase ...no additional transformer to get 120v single phase.... but your BIGGER equip has to run off 208 and not 240v.
If your chargers could run off 208v, this would be the way to go, as you also get 120v.
Edited by steve(ill) - 15 Oct 2021 at 9:22pm
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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tadams(OH)
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Posted: 16 Oct 2021 at 2:35pm |
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Well when no more gas is sold then no more money from gas taxes to repair the roads then what Uncle Joe's 3 Trillion dollar road repair bills will have to pass then we will all be broke.
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Mikez
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Posted: 16 Oct 2021 at 2:45pm |
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also I wonder how it will work. Isn’t there still petroleum products in these cars and stuff. So when they put all the refineries out of business. How does that work
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Tbone95
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Posted: 16 Oct 2021 at 4:18pm |
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Right now, all the examples of calculating costs, are gasoline including the highway tax, electrical costs without. When they slap a huge tax on what goes into your car for highway tax, will be yet another thing that’s not what it seems.
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FREEDGUY
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Posted: 16 Oct 2021 at 5:11pm |
Mikez wrote:
also I wonder how it will work. Isn’t there still petroleum products in these cars and stuff. So when they put all the refineries out of business. How does that work |
The "logic" of the former is beyond my comprehension
Edited by FREEDGUY - 16 Oct 2021 at 5:13pm
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