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1951 WD |
Post Reply | Page 123 8> |
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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Posted: 12 hours 18 minutes ago at 5:06pm |
Mikez that sure is an unloading valve! Neat to see that there's at least one NOS one still around. I am hoping mine is fine but I put in a new ball to be as sure as I can. There's no visible damage, at least.
70224506 would be the PN of the regulating shaft assembly, in case you have one loose and can show how the hole in the shaft is oriented relative to the plate it is pressed into. Otherwise I might be SWAGing it based off of what I can see in the parts book diagram... which is not very scientific.
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 7979 |
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That's it!!
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Mikez
Orange Level Access Joined: 16 Jan 2013 Location: Usa Points: 8143 |
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Is this what your looking for
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IBWD MIke
Orange Level Joined: 08 Apr 2012 Location: Newton Ia. Points: 3440 |
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Sorry, don't have one loose. Hopefully someone else will.
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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Right! It continues...
I am hoping someone can help me with this linkage from the drawbar - anybody have one loose laying around their shop that can take a measurement of where the hole for the crosspin should be located? The shaft came loose from the external arm at some point in the tractor's life and they (poorly) welded it back on, and the welds broke. I have the shaft out, cleaned up, and ready to weld back in but I don't want to mess up the hole orientation. The way the crosspin holds the internal linkage to the shaft seems like it would be important. The first pic shows how it was when I removed it, and I suspect that is not correct. EDIT: Second pic shows the shaft backwards. Luckily it is not welded yet, ha. Edited by wjohn - 21 Apr 2024 at 1:35pm |
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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IBWD MIke
Orange Level Joined: 08 Apr 2012 Location: Newton Ia. Points: 3440 |
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You know what they say, necessity is the mother of invention!
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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I'm crashing onwards with the pump. Everything is cleaned up and I picked up most of the parts I needed. Just waiting on a few that my dealer didn't have in stock. I ended up doing some light filing plus Scotch-brite work to clean up the worst scores in the bore, and some damage to the rearmost control valve sleeve. I noticed two small mangled pieces of metal in the parts washer today that probably caused the damage. I'm not sure where they were hiding at, but that's why it's always good to thoroughly clean everything, right? Files in control valve bores like this is a huge no-no but I figured I didn't have anything to lose on this pump. We'll see if it works out. There were 7 shims on the unloading valve. I decided to leave all of them in. I need to get a 5000 psi gauge so I can check pressure once I have the tractor back together. The AC service manual says you should replace the unloading valve as an assembly. However they are no longer available in 2024. They also provide a procedure "for emergencies" for reusing an old unloading valve with a new ball. You are supposed to press the ball into the seat with 5000 pounds of force and then clean up any deformation in the hole afterwards. I pressed gently with a 20 ton hydraulic press - maybe I only actually got 1 or 2000 lbs. of force on it, but I didn't want to overdo it since I don't have a pressure gauge on my press. |
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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Over a year later I did switch focus and get an IH Super M going in the meantime, and it has become my main tractor. I have to get these ACs operational and earning their keep.
I got a parts washer and I hate to think how many days of cleaning up parts over my life I could have saved. The WD's hydraulic pump has been the first big cleanup job in it. Overall the pump was in far better shape than I expected - not much moisture had been sitting in it. However, I did find some scoring in one of the bores of the pump body. I can catch my fingernail on one of them. I will do my best to polish this out with Scotch-Brite or similar, unless I'm wasting my time? |
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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Thanks to all for the block advice. I picked up another block from a forum member before Christmas. Just got it back from the machine shop where it was dry stripped/blasted, decked, and cleaned. They said they had to take 0.005" off, so I'm anticipating I'll have to take a little off the tops of new the sleeves in order to have the right protrusion above the deck.
They did point out some tiny cracks around one of the 3/8" stud holes for the cylinder head. It looks like there's still a broken off piece of stud way down in the bottom of it so I'll carefully set this up in the drill press and take care of that. The shop wasn't concerned about the cracks and I'm not really either, but I may get a pic of it later this week. No cracks in between the cylinders anywhere.
I was not planning on putting any new paint on this tractor but since I had the block stripped, I had to put something on to keep it from rusting. Cans of PO #1 are almost $20 each from AGCO now. |
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 7979 |
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Sleeving the bores would beat any metal build up process. Not cost effective. Get another block.
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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John,
Just another long shot. very long shot! What about spray weld, or spray metal? Yes would then have to be rebored. The shop I have do do engine work has the capibility. But would not be close by. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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IBWD MIke
Orange Level Joined: 08 Apr 2012 Location: Newton Ia. Points: 3440 |
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wjohn, I think a good used block is in order. If you were to repair that one, Belzona would probably outlast the rest of the tractor. Problem is, you would need to apply it then re-bore the cylinders.
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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Howdy! Like Steve said, I don't think anything would've been able to make this seal swell. It's getting a whole new gasket/seal set now anyhow. I believe the distributor is actually not aftermarket, but OEM (Delco?) from Allis-Chalmers. This tractor would've originally had a magneto as did all WDs before serial number 136318, but someone appears to have swapped in a replacement distributor drive housing and everything from a newer tractor, or bought all the new service parts for the swap back in the day when they were still available.
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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Chris, I've run into suggestions for JB Weld, Belzona, etc. online, but usually for filling pits and such. I pretty well gave up on that idea since I have the whole top 1/4-1/3 of the area flaked away. I don't think it would hold up at all like that. Filling in smaller pits with a generally solid surface around it, I think it would be fine. No cheap date here, I don't think! Like you said, getting another block means more inspections and chances for missing things, too. Here are some better pics after I took a welding chipping hammer and light tapped on the flaky stuff... Disappointing for sure, especially with no cracks to be found in this block. |
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 7979 |
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A WD has a felt seal. Don't think you can add anything to make it swell
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WD User
Bronze Level Joined: 19 Sep 2022 Location: Salina, KS Points: 10 |
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On the rear seal, Lucas Oil Products maks a oil addative that is supposed to swell the seals and might help. Another thing you can try is to use it and you might get lucky and have the seal somewhat seal back up. I have a 1952 WD that had the same thing. Also, the points system on the right side is aftermarket, don't know if you really care about it. I have a 1951 WD parts tractor that has the same thing and I've been told that that the points sytems are a lot easier to work on than the orginal magento.
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1951 Allis WD 1952 Allis WD
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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John,
Sorry I was not up to speed on the shifter. Hate to see you have to get another block. But that may be the answer. I had to do that on my WD45 due to cracks. The danger is another block can have its own issues too. Just a wild thought but could JB weld fill in the voids and be sanded smooth?? I know that is kind of a bandaid for sure. Could work?? Keep at it! Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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There is still crusty stuff I could further remove, but it is eroded well below where the top o-ring would sit. Even in the same bore, you can see spots where the original machined surface is still intact up high, and right next to it will be a spot that is completely corroded away. The lines that look like cracks are corroded well into the machined surface.
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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CTuckerNWIL
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: NW Illinois Points: 22807 |
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If that crusty stuff is on the top side of the bore, I would scrape it off and polish it up. There should be a chamfer, to lead in the o-rings on the top of the bore. That area can get real crusty from the coolant, and sediment settling in above the top o-ring.
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http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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Chris,
Here's a picture of one of the old sleeves. You can see the two o-rings I'm talking about lower down on the sleeve. They both seal against the ugly looking area in the lower part of my block. The new sleeves are similar but still nicely sealed up in the factory bags, so I'm leaving them alone until I'm ready to put the engine together. I did have the shifter off a page or so back. Mostly the retainer for the shift lever was rusted away to nothing. There is some slop, but nothing seemed too terribly worn so I put it back together with a new retainer and boot.
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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Thanks. I will start keeping an eye out for a block.
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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John,
My brain is not working today. Upper seals? Remind me or take a picture or two of the area your concerned about? I was thinking there was just the seal on the bottom of the sleeve? If you dont have cracks in the block in the lower web area you may be able to clean up the seal areas?? On another area: Might be a good time to remove the shift tower and check for wear areas, and possible needed repairs on shift folks etc?? Just sayin.... Your doing great! Keep at it. It will preform like a new old tractor! Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 28 Sep 2022 at 8:30am |
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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Jack, Welcome! You may want to begin your own thread on your tractor project too? The lay down version may be a distributor from a International tractor? I had one like that on one of my uncles WD's too. It had worked fine for a long time. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19491 |
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I wouldn't lose one minutes sleep over that. Where I live, there would be no problem finding a better block for your engine for not much money.
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Jack(Ky)
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Ky Points: 1151 |
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I bought a WD the other day and the distributor lays down instead of being straight up. It's a 50 model. What's the deal with that?
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'59 D14 '68 170 Diesel '81 7020 40 All Crop
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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I started cleaning up the inside of the block tonight and didn't get far. The cylinder sleeve o-ring sealing areas in the block are awful. I measured and compared to the groove locations in the new sleeves, and the lower o-ring should seal fine on all of them, but the upper won't seal on at least 2 of them. They're pretty eroded away and as damaged as these are I don't think I'd trust any type of sealer/epoxy.
I'll be doing some thinking about this. I think my options are to have a machine shop sleeve the block or find a replacement block... Anything else I'm missing?
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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I always use distilled water when mixing antifreeze. Back in FFA we restored a JD A that looked like it must have had pond water dumped inside of it. Like you pointed out, distilled is so cheap that there's no reason not to keep some on hand. This tractor wasn't too bad inside the cooling system. I just thought all that casting flash inside was odd.
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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Dusty MI
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Charlotte, Mi Points: 5053 |
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Last I knew distilled water was about $i.00 a gallon so I used that along with antifreeze, water in this area has lime and iron in it.
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917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express"
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1797 |
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I've been cleaning up the head. Has anyone seen this much flash inside the water passages on your heads? It surprised me. I had a holdup with the old Sioux seat grinder when I started on the seats. The bearings in all of the stone holders were done for, so I had to order replacement bearings and wait on them. Should be good to go again now. I'm still learning how to do seats. I've only done one small engine and those seats were just in the cast iron of the cylinder. Worst case I guess I have to take the head in to have a seat replaced if I mess one up or can't clean it up with enough meat left in it. |
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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jvin248
Silver Level Joined: 17 Jan 2022 Location: Detroit Points: 267 |
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. You might try spraying the rubber part after installation with paint to protect against UV. Imperfect protection, but better than none. Grease on the inside may also protect against ozone creaking too. .
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