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Increasing the Road Speed of a WD45

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OrangeKiwi(NZ) View Drop Down
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    Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 2:33pm
Other than using larger rear tyres, has anybody got any ideas on how to increase the road speed of a WD45 ? Could the gears in the final drives be changed or reversed ? Tractor caravans or tractor treks in our langauage are run at about 18 mph and I'm looking for an Allis that would keep up, with good economy.
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Orange Blood View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Orange Blood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 3:35pm
Put a diesel rear end and tranny in a gas, or a gas engine, in the frame of a diesel.  It's the only thing I can think of.  I think there may be some overdrive trans out there, but, I don't know if they work with the WD/WD45 driveline, as there isn't a lot of room for extra parts.

Don't know if you are ever going to get 18 out of her, heck even the top listed speed on a 7060 at 2200 RPM was just barely over 18MPH with the 18.4-34 tires on it.  Something sounds fishy, very few older tractors could beat the WD45 on the road.  It was known for its "high" road gear, no johny popper beat it that I know of.


Edited by Orange Blood - 09 Jan 2012 at 3:38pm
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HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bill_MN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 3:45pm
isn't the diesel rear geared lower because of the higher RPMs? I had the same idea but I don't think that's right
1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Orange Blood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 3:52pm
Originally posted by Bill_MN Bill_MN wrote:

isn't the diesel rear geared lower because of the higher RPMs? I had the same idea but I don't think that's right

I was wrong, I thought sure the Diesel turned slower, but upon checking the book, the diesel does govern at approximately 200 RPM faster than the gas.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Calvin Schmidt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 3:53pm
14.9 x 38" tires and a 175 govenor spring should get the job done. The diesel rear end will make it slower.
Nothing is impossible if it is properly financed
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dakota Dave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 4:03pm
Must be an international club. 18 MPH is pretty fast on a tractor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jiminnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 4:04pm
I do several caravans and think that is tough for a 45, 38 inch tires and different governer spring is best option but may still be hard to get 18mph. just my thoughts.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 4:08pm
Take the hand clutch out and add a WC transmission in backwards. Low in the WC and 4th in the 45 might get a little scary at full throttle!!! I have seen a picture of one with the WC tranny in the right way which would give you slower gears.
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Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OrangeKiwi(NZ) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 5:01pm
In New Zealand I'm pretty limited as to what axles I can exchange as no D series and only 2 WD45 Diesels came here. I like Charlie's idea of the extra WC gearbox and they're plentiful here. I'll investigate this option further.

As for being an International club trek, they are there but the opposition comes from other British makes, David Brown, Fordson, Nuffield, Massey Ferguson etc. Only good for speeding to the local garage to be repaired, not like AC which were geared for work in the field.

I can't see the point in racing between stops on a trek. I thought the whole point was enjoying yourselves and seeing the countryside? I can't seem to convince the other participants that this should be the case.

Edited by OrangeKiwi(NZ) - 10 Jan 2012 at 1:12pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 5:12pm
Build yourself a little two-wheeled cart for hauling things and have a rearend out of a car underneath it and power it with the tractor PTO....I'd know a full sized Ford car from the 70's will have a 2.50 to 1 rear axle ratio and you just need to figure out what 600 PTO RPM's would give you. Use the cart to haul things related to the ride, like beverages by the case??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dusty MI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 6:30pm
The IHC M was faster on the road than the WD, WD-45. But those Allices would haul a load better, the M's had to shift down on a hill long before the AC's did. 

Dusty
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cwhit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 6:31pm
I'm sure the good Dr. was refering to soft drinks by the case.     lol.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tbran Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 6:56pm
you guys are great with ideas - I like the car rear end - what about a "C" Allis (not the ED pills)  any way to speed this little unit up for tractor rides - 8 mph is tuff my customer found out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote B26240 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 6:57pm
When Jim Ringsred brought his 45 home from Aston ID to Fargo ND he fitted it with 38's and they said it went 18mph, some days they made 150 miles.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 7:09pm

My notes say a WD45 with 14.9 x 38's at 1400 rpm goes 13.8 mph.....at 2000 rpm (D17 governor spring) it would be 19.7 mph. A 14.9 x 38 (63 inch diameter) is just a bit larger in diameter than a 15.5 x 38 (61 inches)....this info is for Firestone rear tires.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 7:30pm
Just now measured my LT245 x 16 pickup tires and they are approx 29 inches tall.......29 x 3.14(pi) is 91 inches in circumference.......At 1700 RPM the PTO runs right at 660 rpm which when going thru a 2.50 to 1 rear axle would be 264 rpm axle speed.....264 x 91 is approx 24,000 inches per minutes or 1,440,000 per hr divided by 12 inches equals 120,000 ft per hr divided by 5280 feet is 22.7 MPH at full throttle.....soooo, with a D17 governor spring at 2000 rpm would be 26.7 mph. Your results may vary. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eldon (WA) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 7:38pm
How about a 4x4 front axle under the front powered by the pto?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 7:52pm
Why would you want to go faster?? With no cab, seatbelts or any other safety feature you might be asking for trouble. You wouldnt want to get killed by a person texting, talking on the phone, putting on makeup, and eating a cheeseburger, would ya??? LOL   Ryan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote XT in pa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:00pm
Dr im very impressed 
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I for one am liking the heck out of this thread; just what I needed after a very long day!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:09pm
Ryan he wants to keep up with the tractor drives that run 18+ MPH. 
 I like Eldon's idea, same results as having the pusher trailer but I would think the front wheels pulling would be safer. Add an electric clutch to the PTO and you could take off in 4th with the rear wheels, shift to neutral and engage the PTO for road gear. 
:)


Edited by CTuckerNWIL - 09 Jan 2012 at 8:11pm
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Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eldon (WA) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:15pm
Originally posted by CTuckerNWIL CTuckerNWIL wrote:

Ryan he wants to keep up with the tractor drives that run 18+ MPH. 
 I like Eldon's idea, same results as having the pusher trailer but I would think the front wheels pulling would be safer. Add an electric clutch to the PTO and you could take off in 4th with the rear wheels, shift to neutral and engage the PTO for road gear. 
:)
Put an overrunning pto clutch on it also to gain a little more speed going down the hills!  Could also hook up the hydraulic brakes from the axle for better stopping power!

Edited by Eldon (WA) - 09 Jan 2012 at 8:23pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:18pm
For the mathematicians out there; how fast would the tractor go if you cut the bull gear out and ran the back wheels off the output shaft at the final pinion? I'm guessin a little too fast for 4th gear.
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Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Orange Blood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:18pm
Well if we are going to all this modification, why not put a blown 454 in the darn thing!!!  :-)
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HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060
Projects: 3-U UC 2-G 2-B 2-C CA 7-WC RC WDLP WF D14 D21 210 7045 N7
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eldon (WA) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:21pm
Originally posted by Orange Blood Orange Blood wrote:

Well if we are going to all this modification, why not put a blown 454 in the darn thing!!!  :-)
....at 4000 rpm problem is solved!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eldon (WA) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:24pm
Originally posted by CTuckerNWIL CTuckerNWIL wrote:

For the mathematicians out there; how fast would the tractor go if you cut the bull gear out and ran the back wheels off the output shaft at the final pinion? I'm guessin a little too fast for 4th gear.
How about a chain and sprocket setup, reduce the bull gear to half the teeth.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DanWi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:34pm
They say the little fords with the sherman overdrive is good for road trips. they don't make an overdrive like that for the wd/45?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eldon (WA) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:42pm
Originally posted by DanWi DanWi wrote:

They say the little fords with the sherman overdrive is good for road trips. they don't make an overdrive like that for the wd/45?
Got my 8N with Sherman running today...it is kinda underpowered in 12th gear.  It sure took a long time to get up to speed...I started out in 3rd just to get things rolling. I can about imagine what would happen when I got to a hill!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2012 at 8:54pm
Wouldn't take a 4545, just a little inline Ford I block 6 from the late 50s would have enough power and hide under an extended hood better. Maybe even a 2 L overhead cam engine.

Gerald J.
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Originally posted by Eldon (WA) Eldon (WA) wrote:

Originally posted by CTuckerNWIL CTuckerNWIL wrote:

For the mathematicians out there; how fast would the tractor go if you cut the bull gear out and ran the back wheels off the output shaft at the final pinion? I'm guessin a little too fast for 4th gear.
How about a chain and sprocket setup, reduce the bull gear to half the teeth.
 I don't know how fast it would go forward but it would go like he!! backwards!  LOL
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