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Conv & Synthetic Blend recipe |
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AC7060IL ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3317 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 25 Mar 2024 at 12:09pm |
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We have an older Toyota Sienna van. It's original 1mzfe v6 just logged 310,000 miles. I do all of its servicing which includes engine oil changes. I noticed when I tried using a full synthetic 5w-30, a noticeable "rod knock" was heard for about 1-2 seconds at every start up. So I visited with other mechanics about it. Apparently, full synthetic oil doesn't exhibit a lengthy bearing "film" or coating as conventional oils. It was explained to me that Synthetic blend is a combination of conventional & full synthetic oils. However the wording "blend" could mean whatever percentages the manufacturer desired. There is no standard blend formulas? They also agreed that the van's higher mileage rod bearing / piston ring wear seems within normal range if its using 1.5 quart per 5000 mile Full synthetic intervals. But I didn't care to hear each start up's rod knock. So to minimize rod knock during start up, I've tried different engine oil options. Our local farm/fleet conventional 5W-30 stopped the start-up rod knock & used about 1.5 qts /5000 mile. Both the High Mileage/ All Mileage synthetic blend 5w-30 lowered usage to 1 qt/ 5000 miles, but still had maybe 1 sec of rod knock at start-ups. So my current recipe consist of 1 quart conventional 5w-30 & 4 quarts of high mileage synthetic blend 5w-30 at change interval. That combination stopped all start up rod knock & usage lowered to 1 qt / 6000 miles. And it seems to be improving? Currently, 4600 miles on 2/3 qt used. Just wondering,,, What vehicle engine oil recipes do other forum members use?
Edited by AC7060IL - 25 Mar 2024 at 12:11pm |
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DanWi ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 18 Sep 2009 Location: wttn Points: 1739 |
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In my 1999 Chevy 7.4 vortec with 150,000 miles I have started putting a quart of Lucas oil treatment in at oil changes with recommended synthetic blend oil. It calls for 5w30. I may go to 10w30 or 15w40 like I use in tractors.
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plummerscarin ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 22 Jun 2015 Location: ia Points: 3356 |
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1989 Chevy 350 TBI. 250,000 miles. Conventional 10w/40. No knock
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Lars(wi) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Permian Basin Points: 7039 |
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The advantage of syn motor oils is the cold starts, syn oils should leave a slight film of oil on surfaces, better than conventional oils. Have you tried other brands of full syn oils? Same results?
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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 79919 |
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AC... if you had good luck fot 300K miles with the DYNO oil... why the change to synthetic ?
That being said... I buy my oil at Wal Mart.. Use to use Havoline 10w30 and they stopped selling it 15 years ago... So i switched to Motocraft and 2 years ago they stopped selling that... Now they sell 6-7 different brands and almost all are Synthetic or Blend... I switched to the House TECH brand of Synthetic 5w30 for the F150 and 5w20 the Ford FLEX...... Edited by steve(ill) - 25 Mar 2024 at 5:47pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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KJCHRIS ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 21 Dec 2015 Location: WC Iowa Points: 867 |
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I'd Try your previous oil again at next service to see if noise stays or goes!!
I've run 5W-30 synthetic blend in 2 vehicles since new. The 2001 has 330,000+ and 2010 has 140,000+ miles, both are Ford 5.4 V8's, 5,000 mile oil & filter changes no issues with leaks or noises. |
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AC 200, CAH, AC185D bareback, AC 180D bareback, D17 III, WF. D17 Blackbar grill, NF. D15 SFW. Case 1175 CAH, Bobcat 543B,
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AC7060IL ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3317 |
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Anyway Rural king 30 miles away still carries conv though( Providence brand). But providence burns too quickly. Some background about this “second Sienna 310,000 van.” Our first Sienna that I had serviced since 98k miles had 246k when my Wife had a head on collision with some young girl on her phone that abruptly turned in front of wife in 30mph town street. Everyone was fine, but insurance totaled 1st sienna. So I located a same year/model 2nd Sienna to replace it. 2nd Sienna had 212k when we purchased it from a retired couple that kept some (timing belt/h2o pump) service good except 1mzfe’s pcv valve had clogged. :( So during my initial servicing it, engine valve cover gasket needed servicing, power steer pump kit, exhaust leaks, etc,, I found engine’s valve covers coated with oil sludge. I scrapped out sludge & wanted an oil treatment that would remove sludge without thinning oil~ no diesel, no sea foam, no ATF, etc. To my findings, full synthetic oil has ability to remove sludge if short intervals(5k miles), longer oil filter to contain sludge, & remove oil pan to clean oil pump screen of coffee grounds. It worked great for about 60,000 miles then I started noticing start-up rod knock. Coffee grounds cleared up at about 20,000 miles(4 changes later. Anyway thats how / when the recipes began. Edited by AC7060IL - 26 Mar 2024 at 9:54am |
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tadams(OH) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Location: Jeromesville, O Points: 9991 |
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I have always had Ford change my oil every 5,000 miles, they use the blend oil. Now on our new 2024 Escape it says the dash will tell you when to change your oil, so I am going to see how many miles I go tilll it says it time.
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Lars(wi) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Permian Basin Points: 7039 |
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The wife’s 2009 Explorer had the dash display that indicates ‘oil change needed’, usually around 8,000-9,000 miles when using full synthetic. Previous auto she had was a Chevy Impala that also would trigger the oil change at 9,000 +/- miles. |
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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 79919 |
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EXTENDED oil changes are pushed by the Factory to show lower maintenance cost... NOT a good idea if you have Variable Cam Timing or a Turbo.... If you got a very basic old 4 -6 or V8.. might be OK to go 8-9000 miles... DONT do that on VCT or Turbo engine.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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NEVER green ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Location: MN. Points: 7147 |
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Lucas oil claims they eliminate "dry starts" this might be a good opportunity to see if the claim holds up?? My brother worked at a small engine shop and he said he could tell if the customers used Lucas because the parts were so slippery to hold on, he verified it with each customer.
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2-8050 1-7080 6080 D-19 modelE & A 7040 R50
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AC7060IL ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3317 |
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AC7060IL ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3317 |
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 79919 |
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If you want a Synthetic oil and the 5w30 is "to thin" and causes the knock.. You might switch to a 10w30 oil and see what happens.. Even a 15w40 might work ??
Seems like "synthetic" is the name of the game now.. Some places dont have much of a selection ( if any) on conventional oils..
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Thad in AR. ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Arkansas Points: 9388 |
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My 2000 GMC 6.0 LS has 600000 on the original motor. Never had a drop of synthetic oil in it. Quaker state 10/30.
It rattles on startup on cold mornings. |
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AC7060IL ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3317 |
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AC7060IL ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3317 |
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Thanks for the "rattles on startup on cold mornings" comment. Maybe its more common place that I thought?
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 79919 |
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Few years back, FORD was complaining that some AFTERMARKET filters did not have decent or any check valve in them... They said the valves HOLD OIL up in the filter when motor is off ( horizontal mount filters)... Seems like some 5.4 V8 owners were complaining about RATTLE ON START UP... FORD said it took a few seconds to refill the filter when the engine starts.. Solution to RATTLE was to use the MOTORCRAFT filter.... Seem to solve the problems..
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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AC7060IL ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3317 |
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Funny you mention motorcraft filters. Throughout this endeavor, I've cut open & viewed filter media content to note sludge amounts. The first two filter I used were the FL-400s on the initial Synthetic oil intervals. Back then, the FL-400s were a readily available filter(Walmart) that fit this engine & were a longer version filter to help capacitate sludge collection. They did ok. Here is a list of the 20 oil filters I've used during this endeavor(begin-recent). OCI ~ oil change interval. They all claim to have Anti-drain back valve to protect against dry starts and oil leaks. That was a feature I felt was necessary to omit any sludge draining back from filter into engine. Not to blame them, but the Wix 51516 was being used when I initially noticed the start-up knock. I like Wix & don't think the knock was due them as much was the synthetic/synthetic blend oils. To my understanding, the latter 3 oil filters are all mfg by same company (Mann+Hummel). Motorcraft FL-400s, OCI 1 & 2 Wix 51516, OCI 3 thru 18, Carquest R85516, OCI 19, Purolator L20195, OCI 20. |
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Kenny L. ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: NEIOWA Points: 1261 |
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I had a 1999 F250 super duty and that old girl didn't like any other oil filter but Motorcraft, when using other filter the 7.3 would rattle more on start up using the same oil Motorcraft 10w30 blended synthetic.
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Thad in AR. ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Arkansas Points: 9388 |
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wade89 ![]() Silver Level ![]() Joined: 12 Feb 2018 Location: Northern MN Points: 200 |
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Everything I own runs conventional Castrol mixed with Castrol High Zinc 20/50 weight and a quart of Lucas stabilizer and they’ve all got high miles. Yukons currently at 265,000 with no issues. Problem I’ve run into with synthetics is losing rear main seals and having oil leaks pop up wherever it can make its way out.
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AC7060IL ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3317 |
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Update: Just completed another 5k mile oil change interval (OCI) using the 1qt Conv/4qt Syn Blend receipt.
Engine start-up knock has been eliminated. And it seems that engine’s sludge around piston rings has been removed some because during the last two 5k mile OCI, I’ve not had to add any oil to remain in safe dipstick range. Dipstick range says add 1qt at lowest safe level. So oil consumption has decreased from 1qt to about 1/2qt per OCI. Seems the synthetic oil blend claim of cleaning out engine sludge safely is true. This process so far has taken 100k miles (212k - 314k). Mileage has increased slightly 1-2mpg? Mileage increase could be a number of factors though & not just engine performance? Edited by AC7060IL - 09 Jul 2024 at 2:48pm |
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Steve in NJ ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Andover, NJ Points: 11732 |
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I've always used Cam II 5-30 Conv oil in the shop Astro Van. At a little over 150K the engine is still nice n' quiet. The ole girl just turned 20 years old this year. I don't drive it in the Winter, so it still has sheetmetal on it yet. LOL! Winters can get tough out here sometimes, and the town isn't bashful with the salt n' brine. Has a little leak out the front timing cover seal, but nothin' to drastic as of yet. I do oil and filter changes every 3500 miles on that. In Jo Jo's Caddy CTS, that always took 5w30 Synthetic. That's a 2007 with just under 97K. So far no leaks anywhere, no knocks, and nice n' quiet. I change the oil and filter in that every 5000 miles. I use Kendall Synthetic in that one.... Steve@B&B
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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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tadams(OH) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Location: Jeromesville, O Points: 9991 |
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My 2024 Escape just told me it's time to change the oil at 9,400 miles. I have it scheduled to be done next week.
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