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hd 5 |
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shanksmare
Bronze Level Joined: 12 Nov 2017 Location: Washington Stat Points: 25 |
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Posted: 20 Nov 2017 at 10:45am |
Well my left side steering clutch is still stuck after sitting a couple years , per info I washed the compartment out and now I guess I"ll pull it in the shop and start in, this is my first time removing one and I'm assuming If I get it out I can take it apart and if not worn out can just free it up, any helpful comments are appreciated , thanks Ron.
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CAL(KS)
Orange Level Joined: 18 Sep 2009 Location: Chapman, KS Points: 3786 |
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can you elaborate on what you have done? did you try using the machine with the lever pulled? how did you wash it?
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Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20
Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15 |
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Ages Cat
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Hutchinson, MN Points: 688 |
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We rebuilt the clutch compartments on our HD-5. The fiber discs used in the clutch packs absorb moisture and creates a situation where the metal discs rust into the brake drum/clutch housing. These were so bad that the drum had to be cut out with a reciprocating saw. Get rid of the fiber and replace with bi-metal discs. That should prevent it from seizing again. You will need to add discs as the bi-metal are thinner than the fiber. The service manual explains it very well.
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Curt Anderson
HD3, HD5B, HD6AG,HD6B dozer, I-400,615, 616,620,720,ACP25 lift truck, 1956 D Grader, AC 540 loader, AC #84 plow, Simplicity tractors, Agco MT225, Agco 2025, |
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shanksmare
Bronze Level Joined: 12 Nov 2017 Location: Washington Stat Points: 25 |
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Well I pulled the inspection cover off and the rubber grommet on the steering clutch lever was pulled back and the chamber looked to be full of a rats nest or something, I vacuumed it all out and put a plug in the bottom and put a few gallons of solvent in it and ran it for a while back and forth and then drained it and let it dry out. I then ran it around the pasture with the lever pulled back and turned a bunch forward and back and its still stuck. I pulled it in the shop and am getting ready to pull the fuel tank and battery box and see if I can pull the clutch out per service book.
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gemdozer
Orange Level Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Points: 970 |
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Dont forget to loosed the support bolt under stering cluch housing and remove the 2 big plugs rear the sprocket on side stering cluch housing for remove the 2 pines from the brake band and bracket
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Coke-in-MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41481 |
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I slide hammer works great for removing them pins - you can make one up using a long piece of threaded rod or other such -
The next problem is the hope the discs have not swelled so as to not allow room to lift out the brake - clutch drum without damage to anything including itself.
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
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Dozer
Orange Level Joined: 16 Aug 2011 Location: SW New York Points: 689 |
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There are several steering clutch posts on this forum. My post
"Like I Need Another Project" is on page 3 of this forum. There are pictures of my ongoing HD5 project. If you have another brake drum available it is easiest to cut the drum to get the steering clutch assembly out. I did not have another drum so the project took much longer. |
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Ages Cat
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Hutchinson, MN Points: 688 |
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In addition to the discs being rusted to the drums, we found that the large roller bearings which are the bearings which the steering clutch uses to exert pressure on the clutch pack were destroyed. Bearing races were split and balls missing from the bearing cages. The older tractors used a wick system to lubricate these bearings. It apparently was marginal at best because it was replaced with a grease hose attached to the access plate with a grease fitting. With a machine as old as these things are there will be surprises once you dig into it. We fixed everything in each compartment and the tractor steers and works like a charm. It is an HD-5B with a transplanted 3-71 Detroit which converts diesel fuel to noise. Thankful I found a new old Stock Nelson muffler for it.
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Curt Anderson
HD3, HD5B, HD6AG,HD6B dozer, I-400,615, 616,620,720,ACP25 lift truck, 1956 D Grader, AC 540 loader, AC #84 plow, Simplicity tractors, Agco MT225, Agco 2025, |
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shanksmare
Bronze Level Joined: 12 Nov 2017 Location: Washington Stat Points: 25 |
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Now my next question is I'm having a problem getting the cap screws loose on both sides of the clutch. with not much room to work what does everyone use to get a socket or something to fit down in the compartment to get a good hold of and turn out these bolts?
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DMiller
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 30711 |
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Home made long reach boxed end wrench for leverage and size dimensions.
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Dozer
Orange Level Joined: 16 Aug 2011 Location: SW New York Points: 689 |
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If you are talking about the steering clutch bolts I use the box end of a combination wrench. I tie a string to it because if you drop it into the steering clutch compartment it is gone until you get the clutch pack out.
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Ages Cat
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Hutchinson, MN Points: 688 |
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We used a Williams 1224TSB, which is the 3/4" tubular handle wrench, made for high torque applications. You will have to make sure you have the tractor jacked or able to roll it to get at all of the bolts. It will have to move about two feet fore and aft.
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Curt Anderson
HD3, HD5B, HD6AG,HD6B dozer, I-400,615, 616,620,720,ACP25 lift truck, 1956 D Grader, AC 540 loader, AC #84 plow, Simplicity tractors, Agco MT225, Agco 2025, |
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gemdozer
Orange Level Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Points: 970 |
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Dont forget you need to removed 1 bolt left side and 1 bolt right side until they all removed
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darrel in ND
Orange Level Joined: 22 Nov 2009 Location: Hebron, ND Points: 8623 |
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I started a "steering clutch project" on my HD5G about 3 years ago. Still isn't done. It's been a "One step forward and two steps backwards" type project. Maybe I should sell you all of my new parts, and abort the mission. Darrel
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gemdozer
Orange Level Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Points: 970 |
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I am still have a small parts inventory and in FEBRUARY I will have 74 years it will be easy to closed my place next year.
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shanksmare
Bronze Level Joined: 12 Nov 2017 Location: Washington Stat Points: 25 |
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Well I finally got my Williams box end wrench and am getting the clutch bolts loose. Now the brake band bolt that you thread the 5/16 rod in is froze solid. The brake lining looks ok but is I can't get that pin out how will I lift the clutch up and out of there, I sure its heavy as hell?
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gemdozer
Orange Level Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Points: 970 |
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The pine in band could be worn and have a grove on and maybe you have to play with the brake band or the fork and pull the pine in same time
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Dozer
Orange Level Joined: 16 Aug 2011 Location: SW New York Points: 689 |
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I have posted again to "Steering Clutches Again" If you can not get the bell crank pins out then remove the (4) bolts that hold the bell crank bracket. You will have to remove the rear brake band pin and swing the upper part of the brake band up to gain access to the bracket bolts.
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Coke-in-MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41481 |
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the pins have a area where the band ends kind of index into - that along with the fact they get rusty and seize - special words are used while trying to remove them - these are like a magic chant you will use often in many situations while working on older machines . Exorcism might also work but in most cases slow and steady thinking of WHY will give results.
On one machine i found a saws all solved the problem of pin removal - I just had to make new ones from SS stock I had to replace the 3 pieces left by the saw .
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
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shanksmare
Bronze Level Joined: 12 Nov 2017 Location: Washington Stat Points: 25 |
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Ya I was lookin at that. I figured I may be able to get the 4 bracket bolts out and then use the brake band to pull the steering clutch straight up and out, and other thing I found today that some had added several long cap screws when they last had that clutch out so that was fun but got them all out today thanks to that handy Williams wrench someone told me about.The right compartment looks brand new inside compared to the left, next thing will be to find a new brake rod rubber boot, that's obviously where the mice gained entrance to the compartment .
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Coke-in-MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41481 |
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Watch the length of the bolts - I had one pressure plate collapse as someone had put wrong bolts in and they ate into plate causing it to collapse (bend where worn) creating a clutch that would not release - each side of drum uses a different length bolt to be secured.
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
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Dozer
Orange Level Joined: 16 Aug 2011 Location: SW New York Points: 689 |
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Your next challenge is pushing the clutch pack into the drum. You need to move it 1/4" to get clearance to get the assembly out.
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shanksmare
Bronze Level Joined: 12 Nov 2017 Location: Washington Stat Points: 25 |
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so whats the best way to push the clutch plate in, I don't have any porta power?
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Dozer
Orange Level Joined: 16 Aug 2011 Location: SW New York Points: 689 |
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Like Coke-in-min said: Special words are like magic. On my HD5B project I found words that actually remove rust and start small fires on the equipment.
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jerbob
Orange Level Joined: 07 Aug 2017 Location: Michigan Points: 961 |
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Hahaha,,, well said oh wise one!
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LeonR2013
Orange Level Joined: 01 Jan 2013 Location: Fulton, Mo Points: 3500 |
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Got to be careful about blistering the paint too. LOL
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shanksmare
Bronze Level Joined: 12 Nov 2017 Location: Washington Stat Points: 25 |
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Well, I've used a lot of words that I cant write here but I managed to get all the bolts out of the steering clutch and got the 4 bolts out of the brake bracket being the pins wouldn't come out of the brake band mount so the clutch still seems pretty solid still, keep in mine there is some rust in the compartment and I've seen much worse in other posts. the clutch lever does move the yoke just a little so its free, but if I need to push on something else, keep in mind this is my first time and I don't hardly know what I'm looking at.
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dadsdozerhd5b
Orange Level Joined: 27 Sep 2009 Location: lansdale pa. Points: 527 |
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the clutch needs to go into the drum about 1/2", it should not be sticking out of the drum at all. most likely the fiber discs are rusted fast to the drum from the mice peeing in the center of the drum. if you cannot get the clutch pack to go into the drum you will need a portapower to push it in and even then no guarantees. I have had to cut the drums apart to get them out. instead of the rubber boots I made a pipe and washer arrangement to stop the mice from getting in. they will chew right through the boots again. check the posts here I put pics on somewhere. I will try to find them again and post.
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HD5B, HD5G, (2) FARMALL A's, CUB. DO IT RIGHT THE FIRST TIME, IGNORE THE LAUGHTER. FLANNEL IS ALWAYS IN STYLE.
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