Time for me to get a plasma cutter
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Construction and other equipment
Forum Description: everything else with orange (or yellow) paint
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=141222
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Topic: Time for me to get a plasma cutter
Posted By: Dozer
Subject: Time for me to get a plasma cutter
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 7:07am
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I have noticed how the price of plasma cutters has fallen. There are so many brand names that are from the same manufacturer. The same machine perhaps painted a different color is $300 here and $1200 else ware. Some are 3 in 1 machines offering 200 amp tig and stick welding as well as plasma cutting. Does anyone know if this feature takes away from the plasma cutting ability? The ac/dc tig welder I have is a lot larger and heavier. I am looking to find a 50 or 60 amp plasma cutter with HF start for $400 or less. The video's I have watched indicate this size is up to what I want to do. |
Replies:
Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 7:37am
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Have to look close at these machines. Many will not handle 100% duty on greater than 1/8" sheet steels, many won't do gouge work. I have also been watching a few but the ones I would buy that will handle 1/2" or greater are still at $1200 or more even used. I bought a DC stick welder from Miller that is also TIG equipped but without the gun or gas tank for work around here, decided to spend the money on a worthy machine that will also be long lived. On 1/8" DC 7018 rods was running one right after another with no hesitation on the machine, stepped up to 3/16" dc 7018 for some serious heavy work for a friend at 160amps where still ran the same rate. To me was worth the $2000 spent. I am looking at Miller for their plasma unit #675($1800), Hobart sells one #27I capable for 5/8" mild steels at $1200 on sale at some providers. Would be the only two I would currently consider. |
Posted By: Coke-in-MN
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 8:18am
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Son bought one 2 years ago but has not got it set up yet - seems he wants full shop building to install it as the table is 9' x 18' and the computer driven head stands about 4' above table - 3 phase power for cutting transformer - thing arrived on 50' flatbed. bought it on auction out of Kansas City fab shop - they bought newer and bigger unit. Oh he has a small unit but seldom uses it now - for heavy plate he uses a tracer cutting head using oxy- MAP (he built his own tracer torch) for lighter material for bucket fabrication he bought a Milwaukee steel cutting saw (like a skill saw) with carbide tooth circular blade. ------------- Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
Posted By: Dozer
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 5:28pm
| I have been looking at plasma cutter forums. Early responses to questions were bashing the Chinese low priced cutters. Later responses said that if the low cost machine was short lived you could buy 2 or 3 more for the price of a brand named machine. They also pointed out that the name brands are imported. The Cut50F @ $285 has 60% duty cycle @ 50 amps cuts 3/4" steel @ 7 inches per minute. I am trying to find out if this is true or just inflated advertising. The list price is $1769 I have found what specs like the same machine for over $1000 |
Posted By: Dozer
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 5:45pm
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My second welder was an Airco My 3rd welder was an inexpensive Lincoln from Central Tractor. The cheap welder out performed the Airco and is still working after 40 years. My first welder was a piece of junk. Note that I am on both sides of the cost vs brand name argument. |
Posted By: DiyDave
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 6:20pm
I bought a hypertherm 50 amp, about 10 years ago. Hadda bent 4n1 bucket to cut open and it wouldda cost $2500 for the bucket, so the $1250 for the cutter was a no-brainer...
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Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 7:14pm
| Going to $1800 the Miller 675 gets more affordable as to long lived and quality/dependability. |
Posted By: darrel in ND
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 7:20pm
| I've had a hypertherm for about 5 or 6 years now. It doesn't get over used, but sure is nicer to have for some jobs. Would never want to be without it. Darrel |
Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 8:49pm
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I have a hypertherm 380... for about 15 years. Its only a 3/8 inch capacity, but the life and dependability of hypertherm is well known. ------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: wayneIA
Date Posted: 09 Aug 2017 at 1:31am
| I've had a 30 amp, and now have a 45 Hypertherm. A friend bought a "cheap" (around $600) unit from a local farm store that advertised it would cut 1/4" steel (I think it was a 30 amp unit). It would barely cut thin gauge steel, after talking to me he bought a 30 amp Hypertherm and regrets that he didn't do that first. There are other brands out there that are just as good or better, but in the world of plasmas, you generally get what you pay for. Where I work, we have a 75 amp Esab, I wouldn't take that for a gift, my 45 amp Hypertherm cuts cleaner and as fast as what it does. We had another plasma here before that, but I unfortunately can't remember what brand it was. It was smaller than the Esab though, and it too cut as fast and cleaner than it's replacement. |
Posted By: Dozer
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2017 at 7:58am
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The Hypertherm costs ten times what I paid for my Ramsond CT520DY. I should have the CT520D with pilot arc. Rusty painted dirty steel is cut easier with pilot arc. These same machines are available from Wallmart and Home Depot as special order. But none of these sellers knows anything about anything they are selling. Customer service and technical service departments know only how to get a replacement machine if yours does not work. I can blast holes in clean steel with the plasma cutter but I need a much larger air compressor. The TIG welder welds better than my Lincoln that works better than my older Airco welders. The best information was obtained from a repair shop. These Chinese plasma cutters are assembled, not manufactured. Machines from the same supplier will contain different components. The various machines look identical except for the name and paint color. Perhaps there is a common sheet metal fabricator. I have purchased a book on plasma cutting. I should have done this before I bought the CT520DY. I have an analogy of plasma cutting with telling time A sun dial, a Timex, and a Rolex all tell time. The sun dial is the acetylene torch. Looking at it you can tell how it works. The Timex is an inexpensive plasma cutter. Complicated uneconomical to repair but can be thrown away when it breaks The Rolex is the Hypertherm for long term operation. I can afford to throw away 10 Chinese plasma cutters. I have learned about how things work by purchasing cheap stuff from China. Stuff that sometimes does not work as delivered. Fixing is learning. |
Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2017 at 8:33am
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I probably spend too much too soon but depend on the machines I buy to work as I need the machine for repairs to get back to the actions I was performing. I own Miller welders, a good torch set from my gas supplier and decent tools in my box not cheap stuff that spreads or fails when I most need them. I do not find the need to run to town to retrieve a replacement as my time is as precious as my tooling and getting my work done efficiently, quickly leaves me with more screw off time at the end of a hard day not more miles driven and gas used. My neighbors come by to get small things fixed as they know I can get to them pretty quick. I enjoy seeing them light up as they do not have to await a repair shop in town to open to get on their list as they are pretty well overloaded. A single pin cut from a piece of scrap on my lathe or a bushing for a wallowed hole and a mill to round that hole back up for the bushing or a little welding on some rusted piece of machine that should've been thrown out years ago but manages to get the job done one more time until the money to purchase a replacement can be built up. I cannot make everything I want to or fix everything that shows up but have time to look at them. And I have machinery that can fix many of them. |
Posted By: bigcreek
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2017 at 8:47pm
| Hypertherm is the best plasma cutter you can buy. Period. Ive had the Hypertherm 600, 45, 65, and in the near future will get the 85. I do a ton of cnc cutting so they get used a lot in cutting anything between 16 gauge and 1". You certainly get what you pay for. You may pay more up front for the Hypertherm but with its better cut quality and longer lasting consumables it will more than pay for itself. Of course that depends on how much cutting you do. I cut miles and miles and miles of metal a year with my plasma cutters so they earn their keep but I suppose if you only cut a very small amount of metal a year then maybe a cheaper brand would be ok. I don't at all like the Chinese 2 or 3 in one machines. Ive never used one myself but come on its from China, and I have only heard bad stuff about them. Again no first hand experience but plenty of talk from the plasma cutting community I rub shoulders with that they are junk. Don't skimp on a good compressor either. And be sure to invest in a good air filteration system to make your consumables last as long as possible and get the best cut quality you can. |
Posted By: Dozer
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2017 at 6:47am
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Plasma cutters for CNC cutting is a totally different consideration. There is an inexpensive way to achieve high frequency arc stabilization that interferes with the computer control. CNC cutters are forced to use more expensive plasma cutters and/or more expensive shielded computer control. This expense is not justified for hand held plasma cutters. None of you would use your Cadillac to haul manure from the barn. For those with contact in the plasma cutting community, please help us poor folks to select better components for our cheaper plasma cutters. Information about the pilot arc circuit will be helpful. I have read the Hypertherm patents but would not need to consider that approach because I am not using CNC equipment. Which hand held plasma torches and consumables offer the best service life? Help is appreciated. |
Posted By: Ray54
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2017 at 10:45am
| Something tells me Dozer unless your only going to us it one or 2 times a year you will get better value from a name brand other than Harbor Fright. |
Posted By: HudCo
Date Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 9:43pm
| i have never lost money on a lincoln, miller, or hypertherm equipment on the few machines that i have sold used when i have got somthing new or bigger , consumables are redally avaliable and and allso parts and service espeaily when you have to get ajob ou the door |
Posted By: Josh H
Date Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 8:46pm
| I wish i bought one 10 years earlier. When i looked around 5 years ago it seemed everlast was the top of the affordable market. I bought the biggest single phase. Im in grading business and build most attachments. Cut steel up to 1". I've been happy with it and i got my $1,100 out of it long ago. I've been able to get parts and it stopped working on a project last December. Sent it back and they repaired at their cost within 5 year warranty, so their warranty means something. Sure i want a hypertherm but im not a fab shop. I would buy another everlast if mine dies. My brother has liked his everlast tig. |
Posted By: Dozer
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2017 at 3:30pm
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I sold the CT520DY plasma cutter because the plasma cutter did not work well on rusty or painted metal. The CT520DY is a 3 in 1 machine that did TIG welding better than my Lincoln welder. Now I have my second plasma cutter. The lesson is about Pilot Arc plasma cutters. They cost a little more but not nearly as much as Hypertherm. I used my Cut50F with pilot arc to cut up some 1/2 inch steel today. It works great. |
Posted By: exSW
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2017 at 4:08pm
| It's my understanding that plasma cutters lead to big electric bills. Since I live in one of those States that the PUC is bought and paid for by the electric utility that's a consideration. |
Posted By: Tad Wicks
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2017 at 11:15am
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It is all Ford Chevy Dodge, in this case Miller, Hypertherm, Lincoln all have good points and bad points and I have owned all three in various machines, the one thing that I can attest to and it just pisses me off is that most of the machines are getting better and better as far as operation goes and not to long after warranty expires a circuit board will fail and the replacement board will cost as much as the machine did new. They got you over a barrel and they are going to shove it to you either way you go. Some boards can be repaired and I have done that was some success but their replacement parts prices are just redundant, so be aware, I have a pile of dead machines that were all great at one time. Tad |
Posted By: Dozer
Date Posted: 24 Nov 2017 at 7:13am
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Tad I agree the new plasma cutters are not worth fixing. That was part of the research I did. The technology is evolving. Two machines with the same name or number can be different inside making them more difficult to repair. Unfortunately the product engineering is focused on cost reduction. The plasma cutter I just recently purchased is now less expensive. When it stops working I will buy another one. I believe that the age of the heavy transformer based welders and plasma cutters is over. This posting brought out good information from all perspectives. My thanks to all for sharing viewpoints |
Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 24 Nov 2017 at 8:44am
| Can completely agree except as to longevity and function for dollars spent. I spent a great amount on a DC Inverter stick welder, which on 1/8" 7018 has 100% duty cycle as long as I have tried to run it. Is a Miller brand where I know a fella that bought a similar cheap machine from a competitive source. His will not run more than 50% duty cycle same amp and rods, has had it back to the seller twice for repairs and received two replacement machines (less pro-rate) as warranty. He is not happy as it generally lets him down during high demand and need. |