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Engine swap

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Gargoyle View Drop Down
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Joined: 29 Aug 2013
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gargoyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Engine swap
    Posted: 01 Oct 2014 at 10:58am
My 11E is serial 8878. Buda motor as I understand it. Direct drive.

I just found a 11 powershift. I am assuming that it's an EP but I don't know the serial. It has a rod sticking out of the block, but from the pics, it's in way better shape that mine.

Will the buda motor from an E swap directly into later versions? I know this is vague but I'm just brainstorming on if anything is possible here.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mactractor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2014 at 2:12pm
The Buda would go in. You would have to use the flywheel from the 11000 engine to adapt the torque converter, and fit the pumps to the Buda for wet steer tractors that yours does not have. You would be dropping the EP`s engine power by 50 percent which would make it very sluggish
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Gargoyle View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gargoyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2014 at 3:03pm
Thanks Mac

Hmmm I'm awaiting word from the seller  if the other buyer bailed out of not.. I'd break even just by using the rippers and undercarriage.. but it's in such nice shape I'd not want to junk it.. I'd have to find another engine or at least a block..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ray54 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2014 at 8:59pm
I am not sure how the power shift transmission is connected to the engine so this maybe way harder.But I had to think of the old post  about re-powering a direct drive HD 11 with a Detroit V6-71,with big increase in power. The person that did this is machinist so he could also build his own parts as needed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andrew_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 7:37am
I always figured that if the Buda in my HD11B died, I would use a 5.9L mechanical Cumminsin its' place. Might take a bit to adapt the clutch to it, but shouldn't be too bad.

Andrew


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HD11B (S/N: 3880) ~1957
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mactractor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 3:14pm
Dropping from 516ci down to 360ci (5.9) would mean you would have to rev the little Cummins way higher than the Buda to do what the Buda did for you, and it sure wont have the torque at lower revs. The usual equation is high revs = more fuel + shorter engine life, much the same as the Japanese crawlers with high reving, shorter stroke engines.
The 8.3 Cummins would probably go in, as I`ve seen inline 671 Jimmies go in them. The 8.3 would have enough power to work it at lower revs similar to the Buda/AC engines giving you the same ground speeds
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Andrew_D View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andrew_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 5:51pm
Yes, but the HP on a naturally aspirated Buda 516 is pretty close to the HP on the early turbocharged Cummins 5.9L in the Dodge trucks.

8.3L Cummins is 250HP and up. Might be a bit much for the driveline on an HD11 wouldn't it?

Andrew

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HD11B (S/N: 3880) ~1957
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lazyts Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 6:14pm
8.3 Cummins would be the way to go, but should be de-rated.  Could probably get by with smaller displacement on torque converter drive.  I've seen a couple of 745C loaders re-powered with 466 cubic inch Deere engines, which works well, and have heard of 11-B done the same way.  The inline Bosch injection pumps on 11-Bs were actually designed for engines 200 Hp and up, 140 is not pushing the engine's capabilities by any stretch.  Also talked to a guy who put an N7 685T into his 11-B- says it pushes pretty good.
Thing is, right now you can still find an Allis Chalmers 11000 engine if you aren't in a hurry- I've bought and sold four of them in the $1000-$1500 range, much cheaper than any re-power.  I think K&S Farms (on this forum) has a couple of 11000 engines for sale, from 11-B....
Could also look for 11000 from power unit, M100 grader, 745 loaders, 12G, etc, and swap accessories if the engine is of similar vintage.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote norm[ind] Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 7:42pm
  have a 11000 engine for sale    was running when removed from grader   been in building since   574-527-2429 0r  574-342-4668[home phone]
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mactractor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 7:44pm
If you worked an 8.3 Cummins down at the same revs the Buda 516 does, it will NOT produce driveline wrecking power. Remember, those 5.9 and 8.3 Cummins horsepower ratings are at up around 2800 rpm. The Buda/AC 516 works happily at only half those revs. As Trev says, there are still plenty of AC 10000/11000 516 engines around for repowers which are way better engineered power plants than B and C series Cummins.
I`ve had a hand in repairing the baby Cummins when the flywheels jump off them. They are not in the same league as pressure/time fueled Cummins like 855
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote michale34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 9:02pm
There was a 12g in the springfield mo craigslist that had a good engine and trans. Said bad final bearing i dont remember the price it thing 5500
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ac_sd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 9:35pm
Hoover Tractor and Engine in Woodlands, CA did an engine swap in an HD-11AG several years ago in response to California's EPA Diesel engine directive for Diesel engines in AG work. They did it with the AG Department at either UC Davis or Cal Poly, I don't remember which. They used a Cummins engine and I was around the Tractor and don't recall any problems related to that swap. The 5.9 Cummins was engineered in conjunction with Case and used Industrially by Case in various Backhoes and Crawlers. The 5.9 in Dodge pickups is a lighter version of that lineage, the Ford Medium Duty Trucks used a 5.9 application which also is a heavier version. There used to be a Company up in Oregon or Idaho which offered a Kit to re-engine the HD-21B with Cummins power. The FD30 I believe offered a choice of Fiat engine or Cummins power. With proper research, a re-power should be possible, but will take some work!!! Good luck, the HD-11EP was a great little tractor very comparable to the Cat D6C.
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ac_sd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ac_sd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 9:43pm
Some really good responses here, how about a Detroit 4-71N out of a Terex loader. You might get a torque converter to go with it at the same time. It would not be a problem from the physical side, and the 4-71 was used in the HD-9!!!
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